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John Fay
John Fay has been the Reds beat writer for the Enquirer since 2001. Prior to that, he served in a variety of roles for the Enquirer: backup Reds writer, UC beat writer, backup Bengals writer and as a general assignment reporter. He is a Cincinnati native and a graduate of Elder High School and the University of Dayton.

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Tuesday, August 28, 2007

Arroyo pulled after 80 pitches (update)

The Reds pulled Bronson Arroyo after only six innings and 80 pitches.

He said afterward he asked out of the game.

"I was toast, really for the second ininng on," he said. "With the way the bullpen's going, I thought they had a better chance to get nine outs than me."

Arroyo allowed only one run on six hits. He struck out six and walked none. Reds lead 2-1.


at 10:23 PM Anonymous Anonymous said...


You have to win games NOW, especially against the last place team and your #2 on the hill. Then, you bring in Majewski and leave him in vs. the Pirates best left handed stick off the bench, only to bring in Bray a batter too late. Why not bring in Bray to face the lefty? This is why Pete should not be back. A move right out of the Narron book.


at 10:37 PM Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why is Jason Ellison on this team?
Send his lousy, waste of space, a$$ to play in China or something.

Needed to start a right-handed hitting outfielder in game 1? Start Kepp in LF, and put Gonzo at SS.

at 10:46 PM Anonymous Anonymous said...


This manager has blown both games with his lineups and poor bullpen management. Its probably a good thing since I am sure the Reds were going to look for the cheapest manager around for next year and that would be him.

at 10:58 PM Anonymous jordan said...

Arroyo should of stayed in unless he was injured..its seems like they would want to win this game tonight instead of worrying about saturdays game

at 11:08 PM Anonymous Anonymous said...

Amazing how in a double header Ellison gets more at bats then Hamilton and Hatteburg. This guy is just like the rest of the cheap, sorry managers fans have to put up with.

at 11:22 PM Blogger Dan H said...

I have to agree with David and Jordan that this game was more important that saving your starter for Saturday especially after losing game #1. If you lose both games which, has happened, by the time Saturday rolls around it may really be too late. Although looking back to the last couple weeks last year when they seemed out of the race only to climb to within 2 games after the Cards lost about 8 in a row anything can still happen (wishful thinking on my part maybe). Tough day going from 6.5 back to 8 games back. Oh well, take the next 2 and on to St.Lou.

at 11:32 PM Anonymous Justin Fernandez said...

Today was the most disgusting day of the year. Mac can't manage worth a damn sometimes. I'm kicking myself for giving him any credit at all. Ellison is an utter embarrassment. What GM in his right mind has him here? What Manager in his right mind plays him?

I'm back to where I was two-three weeks ago: I can't wait until Castellini, Krivsky, and Mac have moved on.

There will be winning streaks and euphoria yet to come. But I bet the Reds don't make the playoffs until after these three clowns are no longer bungling the Reds.

at 1:00 AM Anonymous Anonymous said...

I certainly can't understand the lineups tonight. You've got to win NOW. Ellison should never be on the field except in mop up duty. And in the first game, once the Bucs had loaded the bases, why leave Ramirez in there. I know the manager is darned if he does and darned if he doesn't, but there just seem to be too many boneheaded moves. Hamilton not starting either game? Ridiculous.

This whole thing with Cantu playing first can't bode well for Votto either. Frankly, I'm not a big Encarnacion fan. Supposedly Cantu can play third, so maybe trade Encarnacion, put Cantu at third, and Votto at first.

What are you going to do with Jay Bruce next year as well? He can't sit the bench, he needs to play. Someone's going to have to go. Either Griffey, Hamilton, or Dunn. Seems like maybe trading A Gonzalez and keeping Keppinger at short might be a move too, although I can't tell if Kepp would be as effective as an everyday player. He sure has seemed like it this year. In the end though, the Reds lack starting pitching and maybe they can package up a few of these guys for a starter somewhere.

at 5:14 AM Anonymous redifil said...

"Toast" after 80 pitches? Geeez! It's good to be honest, but what about wanting to do what a supposed top-of-the-rotation pitcher is supposed to do? Then again, this is why Arroyo is not really a No. 2 starter, and part of the reason their rotation is going to be mediocre, at best, for at least another year or two.
As for Mackanin, we saw Tuesday why he soulde definitely NOT be the Reds manager next year. The Reds had been winning because they had been scoring more consistently and getting better pitvheing out of the pen (except, of course, for Stanton), not because of Pete. He's another guy with little fire and little understanding of how to put his team in the best position to win, which is the manager's job.

at 6:45 AM Anonymous jc said...

i could not believe how poorly mackannin managed last night. ellison.... leaving majewski in to face the lefthander. tracy made all the right moves.... i dont care if they have improved. a team always improves with a new manager when thy have underachieved. the most frustrating night of the year. a huge reawakening call.

at 10:08 AM Anonymous Anonymous said...

And in one day Mackanin is now an idiot. Wow, the transformation is amazing.

at 11:24 AM Anonymous Justin Fernandez said...

Mac is no idiot. He just managed like one last night.

The closer his record is to .500, the more likely it is that he won't, and should not, be given 2008 as a further Reds skipper tryout.

Last night made me think that Atlanta and Florida and Luck deserve equal credit (to Mac's "talent") for the recent win streak.

I'm sure Mac's no happier about losing the twinbill than Reds fans are...but yesterday was an atrocious display of managerial ineptitude.

So bad that it makes me question whether the bad really outweighs the good.

BUT THEN AGAIN...Even the best managers have bad days.

Obviously the Reds can save a ton of money bringing Mac back on the cheap, and using that money to buy some pitching (despite there being almost nothing available in free agency this coming off-season) instead of spending a fortune should a marquis manager be willing to slum with this obviously "hurting" organization...

If the 2007 Reds under Petey are .500 or below...then there's really no way Mac should be back, as this should be a results-based tryout, period.

I blame Krivsky for Ellison being here and A-Gon playing BEFORE he was ready (and for Hamilton not playing long after he was ready...) but gotta applaud Krivsky for Cantu.

P.S. Sending Ellison to play ball in China would be likely construed by the Chinese as an act of war!

at 11:54 AM Anonymous jc said...

he was an idiot yesterday. no transformation. just the facts. he was an idiot yesterday. we don't have the time for it or the stomach for it. the moves he made on the biggest day of his season cqall into question his ability to strategize. it was his first big day since taking over and he came up way short.
bobby valentine would have played for the win.

at 12:05 PM Blogger Cheviot Sports Authority said...

WOW! That long term contract has done wonders for Arroyo(80 pitches and out). Great signing Wayne.

Speaking of great signings: Coffey, Stanton, Freel, Ross and Gonzalez are all signed to big contracts next year, all Krivsky signings.

Looks like when the "nothing to lose" mentality melted away, so did Mackanin's managing skills. Lets sign a proven winner for a change(Larussa) and bring a top flight GM in also.

QUESTION FOR JOHN: Do you know what the problem is with Davey Johnson? Does he not want to work or is he black-listed for some reason? Seems odd that a man with his credentials doesn't have a major league job.

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