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Reds Insider
From news of the day to news of the weird, John Fay provides a glimpse of what it’s like to cover the Cincinnati Reds

John Fay
John Fay has been the Reds beat writer for the Enquirer since 2001. Prior to that, he served in a variety of roles for the Enquirer: backup Reds writer, UC beat writer, backup Bengals writer and as a general assignment reporter. He is a Cincinnati native and a graduate of Elder High School and the University of Dayton.

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Sunday, April 13, 2008

Pirates 9, Reds 1 -- sweep complete

A very bad end to a very bad series.

"There ain't a whole bunch to say," Dusty Baker said. "We got our butts kicked."

It was the first three-game sweep of the Reds by Pirates since July of 2003.

Johnny Cueto's day: 6 IP, 5 hits, 5 runs, 1 walk, 6 Ks. He's was OK right up to the point that Xaiver Nady took him deep with two outs in the sixth.

When we asked Paul Bako about Cueto, he asked: "What was his line?"

He was given it.

"Other than the pitch to Nady, he pitched pretty well -- better than his line indicates as far as runs."

The Nady home run came in the sixth -- Cueto's first ugly inning in three starts. Leadoff double to Nate McLouth. An out. Jason Bay reached on an infield single. Ryan Doumit sac fly. Nady goes deep to left.

Todd Coffey gave up a four spot in the seventh. A three-run homer from Bay put the game one one ice.

And the Reds alleged offense? Nine left on base, 1-for-8 with runners in scoring position. For the series, they left 32 on base and were 6-for-35 (.171) with runners in scoring position. Four runs in three games.


115 Comments:

at 1:58 PM Blogger Ryan said...

Hopper doesn't look like he's hurt, though he limped off the field after upending Bixler and breaking up that DP. Cueto looks good as usual, so we'll see if the bats can do something this time out.

Ryan

 
at 2:37 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

I'm confused. If Cueto gives up two earned runs, no matter how contorted we get in trying to explain it, it still counts as two runs, right? Aren't we on the verge of getting carried away here?

 
at 3:01 PM Blogger Ron said...

What is the possibility/probability that the Redlegs can swing by Cincy on their way from Pitt to Chi and pick up their bats?!

Redlegs!!!

 
at 3:19 PM Blogger Jonesz said...

EE = 0 for 5 with bases loaded and 0-3 in this series alone. HE is simply painful to watch!

 
at 3:23 PM Blogger Frank Robinson's Ghost said...

Al --

I think the answer to your question is "Yes."

But I'm not too sure why you asked the question. What is your point? Also -- what contortions do you see in Fay's post?

P.S. Enjoy Gagne

 
at 3:23 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

...and we expected what with this punch and judy lineup?

 
at 3:24 PM Blogger rb said...

good thing the reds have a manager who understands hitting. imagine how few runs they might be scoring if they had someone who just put the best lineup on the field and let them play.

 
at 3:30 PM Blogger T-Mac said...

How long do the Reds continue to field a line-up that obviously struggles against LHP? I'm not one to hit the panic button, but we had the same issue last year, no? I see another trip to AAA for EE. I agree with John's assessment, let's give some young/hungry players a shot . . . maybe they can inject some life into these guys.

 
at 3:33 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

My point, Frank, is that I sense Reds fans are getting more than a little carried away with Cueto. Has he looked excellent so far? Mostly, yes. But let's keep in mind that he's making his THIRD major league start. When teams get more video on him, it's inevitable he'll get hit more.

As for your Gagne comment: I will. The Brewers haven't lost a game yet that he's pitched in, and he has two saves to Cordero's one. One thing that I think Reds fans forgot in their euphoria over Cordero's numbers with the Brewers: in order to record a lot of saves, you have to have a lot of save OPPORTUNITIES. So far, Koko has gotten to watch a lot.

 
at 3:34 PM Blogger chsroodog said...

I think it is time for the reds to finally make a move with Encarnacion. Granted he had the ONE game winner but it is now time for him to enjoy Chattanooga or the end of the bench. He continues to kill this team. Put Freel at 3rd until Gonzo comes back & then put Keppinger there for good. Brandon Larson, I mean Encarnacion needs to go!!

 
at 3:38 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

My mistake: Cordero DOES have two saves. So, I'll switch my defense to "I'll enjoy Gagne', while you enjoy Arroyo, Fogg, Weathers, et al." I'll also enjoy the Brewers place in the division. Thanks!

 
at 3:41 PM Blogger Zippy said...

Maybe the Reds should trade one of their good young pitchers for Josh Hamilton. I understand he's a pretty good hitter. I notice he just picked up his 12th RBI...

 
at 3:45 PM Blogger Bengal43 said...

Hopper sure looks bad in LF. Even on the homerun that was hit, he was standing 8 feet or so from where it went over the wall.

 
at 3:52 PM Blogger John Fay said...

Cordero is 2-for-2 in saves.

 
at 3:53 PM Blogger Bengal43 said...

I bet Coffey is going to Louisville. My guess is Bill Bray will meet the team in Chicago

 
at 3:53 PM Blogger Joe said...

The true Coffey emerging in 2008? His head is not in this game. This one hurts. Not much positive about this game other than it is about to be over!

 
at 3:56 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

John, if you look through the posts after I wrote that one, you'll see that I corrected myself, saying Cordero has two saves.

 
at 3:57 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

Cordero has 2 saves and a 0.00 ERA. Gagne has 2 saves and a 9.00 ERA and 2 blown saves. The argument that the Brewers haven't lost a game that Gagne has been in despite his woeful numbers is utter silliness.

 
at 3:58 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

Todd Coffey is proof that losing weight won't make you a better pitcher. This guy looks just as bad as last year. He's on the bubble.

 
at 4:00 PM Blogger Tony said...

The Reds have a very serious problem against left-handed pitching that needs to be remedied quickly. It’s dates back to the last few years and it seems to have gotten worse this year. I’ve seen 45 year old rec pitchers throw the ball better that what the Reds faced today. The slop that Gorzelanny was throwing up there was below average major league quality and still it was good enough to keep the Reds scoreless through 6 innings. They need to fix this soon!o

 
at 4:06 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

While I know this blog is monitored, how do we just "lose" posts? I sent one correcting the number of saves Cordero has, which doesn't show up, but one I sent referring to the missing post does?

 
at 4:06 PM Blogger Crusty Baker said...

The front office needs to utilyze this off day tomorrow, and make some moves to improve this team. Here are my suggestions,

Edwin to AAA
Recall Jolbert Cabrera

Coffey to AAA
Recall Bill Bray

Castro DFA
Recall Jay Bruce

Make trade with Sox for Joe Crede Hopper/Freel + PTBNL

Trade Homer Bailey + Edwin Encarnacion for Jarrod Saltalamachia + PTBNL

New Lineup

Bruce CF
Keppinger SS
Phillips 2B
Griffey RF
Crede 3B
Dunn LF
Saltalamachia C
Votto 1B

Bench

Hatteberg
Bako
Cabrera
Freel/Hopper
Patterson

 
at 4:09 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

Let me pose an argument to you this way, richie rich:

Eric Gagne' has appeared in four games, and the Brewers have won all four.

Johnny Cueto has now pitched three games, and the Reds have ended up losing two of those three.

Which would you prefer? Your team to win even when a pitcher pitches badly, or to lose when a pitcher pitches well?

To choose the latter is utter silliness.

 
at 4:10 PM Blogger kingseyeland said...

Will Krivsky wait until it's too late to make a move this year, like he did last year? Will we sit through another agonizing road trip, a horrible May perhaps, before there are some personnel changes on this team?

Or will he man up and release Coffey, demote EE, and have that be just the beginning? Real contending teams don't put up with stuff like this.

 
at 4:10 PM Blogger The Dunce Cap Marvel said...

Richie - I think the bubble for Todd Coffey has burst.

 
at 4:14 PM Blogger John Fay said...

Al: I saw the moderated the first post. Saw you said he had one save. Checked it because I knew I wrote two after his last save. I wanted to make sure I was right. I posted it before I saw the second post.

 
at 4:15 PM Blogger Mutaman said...

"While I know this blog is monitored, how do we just "lose" posts? I sent one correcting the number of saves Cordero has, which doesn't show up, but one I sent referring to the missing post does?"

Al old buddy, if you're point is that Eric Gagne hasn't done that bad the last two years, and that the Brewers will succeed with him as their closer, I wouldn't complain about "losing" my posts.

 
at 4:17 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

Any lineup with Dunn and Votto down near the bottom with their propensity to get on base means you probably shouldn't be making lineups.

 
at 4:17 PM Blogger George44 said...

Hey Crusty even that much will never happen in a day I have to say I like every move besides maybe trading Homer. They are going to need some depth at some point and Homer gives them that. I would so take Crede over EE. I would take any 3 bagger in the league over EE and I am dead serious. He, along with this whole series is sooooo disappointing.

 
at 4:20 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

Here we go:

Freel, Hopper and a PTBNL for Joe Crede -- you obviously haven't see the start Crede's off to, or the fact that the White Sox have pulled him off the market. Not to mention they don't need either Freel or Hopper.

Homer Bailey & EE for Saltalamacchia and a PTBNL -- Let's see a minor leaguer and someone you feel should be sent to the minors for a great young catching prospect. Yep, that'll happen. I guess it could, assuming they haven't seen Homer pitch or EE play 3B.

This regular belief that other teams are going to be willing to trade for the Reds' castoffs is a constant source of amazement to me.

 
at 4:21 PM Blogger kingseyeland said...

Al, I'd be interested in seeing those W/L records whenever Arroyo pitches, but I'm too lazy to dig for those numbers.

 
at 4:23 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

mutaman, I assume you're unaware that as a CLOSER in Texas last year, Gagne' was 16 out of 17 in save situations. Now, as a set-up guy for Boston, he was terrible. He's not a set-up guy for Milwaukee. I have no reason to think he'll struggle like he did in Boston.

 
at 4:24 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Is it early? Yes

Alot of baseball left? Absolutely



But...

This aint the Red Sox, Yankees, Tigers, or Dodgers.

If this team doesnt get this fixed NOW, they will be 10 games out by June 1, and they arent built for a 25 and 5 stretch, not with Arroyo, Fogg, EE, Dunn, Valentin or Ross. You never know what you are going to get from these guys night to night.

As I have said many times, if they can keep it close in the standings they have a shot, if not....

Time to panic? Not quite, but "let em play" and "wait and see" are not options if they want this year to be different.

 
at 4:28 PM Blogger Tommy in Tucson said...

Hey, everyone was praising Dusty last week, what happened? 32 stranded runners in 3 games against the mighty Pirates. Ever heard of a hit and run, bunt a guy over, get a lead every once in a while? No, let's swing for the fences, the fans love it. I'll say it again, the Reds might lead the NL in dingers, but their record will be 75 - 87. Good enough for fourth in the central.

 
at 4:35 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Crusty,

Beutiful, just beutiful.
If that actually happened I would cry.

If Krivsky is on this trip, he and Dusty need to lock themselves in a hotel room and discuss some business.

 
at 4:39 PM Blogger robby said...

Calling on Krivsky to do something now, before it is too late implies that this team is good enough to be playing for something come August and September. There is no chance of this team playing for anything come the end of the summer. It looks like the same uninspired, group fans have come accustomed to watching. It's a long season, but this team is boring, lacks enthusiasm,is fundamentally challenged, and can't hit in the clutch.(these problems aren't new, but Krivsky is doing a great job) And despite what the organization would lead you to believe, except for a few players, most of the talent in the minors is two or more years away from the majors.

 
at 4:53 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

For everyone's edification:

Milwaukee just took 2 out of 3 from the Mets, with Eric Gagne' picking up the save, 1-2-3.

I did, in fact, enjoy it.

 
at 4:57 PM Blogger chsroodog said...

Something has to be done with the lineup. Phillips isn't getting the best looks at the plate lately & that has to be due to our 5th hitter, Dunn, hitting .167 behind him followed by a .171 hitter in the 6th hole. Are there any teams in the majors with a worse everyday 5-6 combo right now?

 
at 4:58 PM Blogger Mr. Doom and Gloom said...

al..if the point your trying to make is that the brewers are better than the reds, i don't think you're gonna get much of an argument, even from diehard reds fans, especially after the sweep at the hands of the lowly pirates...

but, if the point your trying to make is that gagne is better than cueto or coco cause the brewers have won all 4 games he's pitched, well that doesn't make any sense at all...go piss on someone else's parade, the bucs have done just fine soaking ours this weekend

 
at 5:10 PM Blogger RyanRico said...

Crusty, Love all your suggestions except for dealing Homer. A little patience will go a long way with young pitching. As Marty says, this is "A big ol' hang with em."

EE...gone. Forever. Seriously, hit the road chump. Shake up the roster a little bit by either sending out a reliever or two, Coffey for Bray as has been suggested. Castellini needs to tell Jocketty and Dusty to shut the heck up with the veteran argument, inject some youth with Bruce and let Votto play everyday.

And for the love of god Baker, don't play Hopper, Freel, Castro, and Keppinger in the same lineup again...EVER.

 
at 5:37 PM Blogger Grizzlyfox said...

Jeez Al so when the Reds were taking 2 of 3 from the Crew you pretty much disappeared, but now that the Rats swept the Reds all the sudden you're posting like there's no tomorrow. Gotta be kidding me on Cueto too. If you're a Reds fan, you'd enjoy him. You're not. You just like bashing us, and found the perfect opportunity to do so after this sweep by the Rats. If they go out and win 5 of 6 or something like that you won't be here.

 
at 5:51 PM Blogger 24/7 said...

al,

here's a chance to take some things back. which would you'd rather have?

a leaky bullpen thats NEVER gonna be solid because the personnel suggests such, or a rotation+bullpen that's been solid to great minus coffey and weathers. we say this every year in april-are the reds' bats gonna wake up? and sure enough they do, every year.

last week, the reds took 2 of 3 from the milwaukee brewers in milwaukee, and i had a ball watching it.

other business...

the trade suggestions
a. aren't feasible
b. are bad for the reds, the other team or both, but mostly for the reds.

if homer keeps the ball down and trusts his stuff with 2 strikes, he's gonna be something like what we have in volquez. i'll take my chances that a 21 yr old can figure that much in time.

criticizing batting order is one thing, but personnel in the lineup is too far. the team has a lot of guys who can contribute, as well as surprise in roles they aren't believed to be strong in a la the way freel and patterson have hit, and how keppinger has bunted. if the A team ain't gettin' it done, the B squad deserves a shot, and has played well.

this is baseball. a flight to chicago could be what the reds needed to get going, at least for a few days. just as shamefully as we were swept, the cubbies could be feeling the same come thursday.

 
at 5:53 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

To answer two of my favorite posters, Doom and Gloom and Grizzlyfox:

My intention, Doom and Gloom, isn't to point out that the Brewers are better than the Reds; I don't think anyone who follows baseball seriously would doubt that. It's that what fascinates me about this blog, and the Bengals blog, is the mindset of the Cincinnati sports fan. This blog seems to contain, a lot of times, two distinct groups of people: those who think the Reds are going to win it all this year, Cueto is going to go 28-2 and win the Cy Young, ROY, and be inducted into the HOF as an active player, and those who, after every loss, want Krivsky and Baker fired, EE/Dunn/Coffey/Freel/Gonzalez traded, and the team all but disbanded.

I'm all for optimism. And Griz, I've watched Cueto's last two starts BECAUSE I wanted to see him pitch, and the Reds and their fans are justifiably optimistic about him. But some of the comments I've seen go well beyond optimism into the realm of unrealistic delusion. It's just like after the Bengals went 11-5 a few years ago, and their fans started looking into Super Bowl tickets for the next year. I've honestly never seen anything like it, in all of the sports blogs I've read, and in all of the places I've lived. It's always boom or bust, 100% good or 100% horrible with the Cincinnati teams. I read on here how Jack in Blue Ash was hammered for predicting that the Reds would IMPROVE by 10 games or so this year.

And no, Griz, I don't like bashing the Reds or their fans. Any regular visitor to this blog can attest to the fact that Reds fans do more than a good enough job bashing each other and their team. I agree with Jack in BA: sit back, enjoy the season and the incremental improvement you'll probably see in the Reds' W-L record, follow the development of the young players, but for God's sake, take off the rose-colored glasses that predict the playoffs this year (for those of you who believe that), and cast away the "doom and gloom" that sees nothing good about this team (for those of you who believe THAT).

 
at 5:58 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

24/7 -

Are you implying that the Reds' pitching staff, top to bottom, has performed better than the Brewers'? Good Lord, man, the ultimate measure of a pitching staff is wins. This is another mindset that absolutely kills me. It's as though, even though the Reds just got swept by Pittsburgh, and have a sub-.500 record, I, as a Brewers fan, should be worried because, I guess, the Reds will get nothing but better while the Brewers will get nothing but worse. I guess the simple answer to your question, if I understand it, is NO, I wouldn't trade the Brewers present or future this season for the Reds.

 
at 6:02 PM Blogger AReds83 said...

3 points.
1) EE. I've asked before. How long do you continue to go with this headcase? How long do you wait for his "breakout season"? I don't care how many walks he draws, or what his numbers were last year. I've said before that he's too fragile mentally. You can see it. If he has a bad game, expect a bad month. Are we going to keep sending him to AAA every year? Edwin you're a big boy now, take off the training wheels.

2) I don't care if they're facing a tough lefty. Are you telling me that Juan Castro gives you a better chance to score runs against lefties that Votto? There's a reason he doesn't play much. This is a team that isn't scoring and you send Norris Hopper, and Juan Castro out on the same day because they bat from the right side? Why don't we just platoon our whole team!? I couldn't agree more with ryanrico.

3) Play Joey Votto. Against righties, against lefties. Play him. This is getting ridiculous. When did it become the norm to baby players like this? He gets 3 hits one day, then he sits because of a left-handed pitcher? The righty-lefty match-up thing is overrated. Let him play.

 
at 6:13 PM Blogger Zippy said...

Hey Al,

When Bill Hall plays, his team has been 8 and 4. When A-Rod plays, his team has been 6 and 6. So does that mean the Brewers are better off having Hall than A-Rod?

 
at 6:21 PM Blogger unblogger said...

Al,

"the ultimate measure of a pitching staff is wins. "

Perfect case of where one can hold his tongue and let everyone think he is an idiot or speak and remove all doubt.

A pitching staff will have exactly as many wins as the team. DUHHHH!

A great pitching staff on a 70 win team will have exactly as many as a poor pitching staff on a 70 win team.

Wins is perhaps the worst way to judge a pitching staff. ERA, K's, walks, BA against, etc, are all much, much better.

I wouldn't trade the Reds staff for the Brewers staff, if you cloned Ben Sheets four times. The Brewers bullpen is horrible, and will be the death of team.

 
at 6:22 PM Blogger bluegrass said...

Votto is someone who has proven to maybe hit lefties well. So, why didn't he play. Obvious to insert Freel, but not both Hopper and Castro at the same time. They need to at least move EE around in the batting order, and that may be all that's needed. Have Freel platoon for use with only and all righties.

 
at 6:34 PM Blogger ankurv5 said...

That was fugly. I said in a comment on Thursday or Friday about bringing the brooms to Pittsburgh. I guess I was right.

I think this team just needs to get a kick in the rear to get them charged up. Maybe Dusty getting kicked out of a game or something like that? A Harang start on Tuesday should help.

 
at 7:03 PM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

"I wouldn't trade the Reds staff for the Brewers staff, if you cloned Ben Sheets four times. The Brewers bullpen is horrible, and will be the death of team."

And, as a Reds fan, I wouldn't expect you to. I admire your loyalty. You're crazy, but you're loyal.

Could you please fill me in on which "great pitching staff" in ML history had only 70 wins? Has there been a team with a "great pitching staff" that went 70-92?

 
at 7:11 PM Blogger BATSFAN said...

Hey John, do you think something is going to happen transaction wise, before we play the Cubs on tuesday?

 
at 7:17 PM Blogger Don said...

Although Bako is most likely sticking up for his young pitcher, his comments are off the mark. I love Cueto and I think he is and will be a major addition to this rotation, but Bako saying "other than that pitch to Nady" or "better than his line indicates as far as runs" would be like saying Romo played well except for those four INTs. Cueto did not pitch well. You don't pitch well regardless of what the other stats may reflect, when you give up five ERs. Striking out six doesn't account for much when you give up 5 ERs in 6 IP.

 
at 7:27 PM Blogger MPCB said...

It drives me crazy how quickly we Reds fan jump on and off the bandwagon. A few good starts and we are talking playoffs...then a bad stretch and its...trade this guy, send this guy out, fire Krivsky.

Its a long, long season people. This team will hit. That has never been a question with this group. They are slumping early, but it will come together. When Gonzalez comes off the DL and Kepp goes to third base, the team's numbers against lefties will improve. Dunn will still get his 40 round-trippers and drive in 100 which will end up winning a bunch of games before the season is out.

Marty's "big ole' hang with 'em," is exactly what this town needs to remember in early April.

 
at 8:14 PM Blogger Cheviot Sports Authority said...

Who wants to tell me what a great job The Amazing Krivsky has done with this team? Basically the same bunch of losers who have been here for years. You can not win consistently with a lineup so dependent on Dunn and Griffey.

This team is not scoring any runs, so Baker's answer is to put Castro in the lineup?

Did Krivsky ever give any explanation at all as to why Cantu was let go? Whose breakfast did Cabrera $51& in? Why isn't he here, or Andy Phillips? Please no more Baker Boys (Hairston). We know what he can't do.

Maybe The Amazing Krivsky will give Freel and Coffey raises. Opps, no he already did that. How about a contract extension for Gonzalez, how much is he making? Other than signing David Ross, why has the catching situation not been addressed in the 3 years that he has been here?

The 'experts' predicted Krivsky as the first GM fired this year. Looking like they may be right for a change.

ST CSA

 
at 8:49 PM Blogger Jon said...

Al in Ohio,

I agree with you that Reds fans are either all in or all out. But getting chided for being delusional by a Brewers fan is hilarious. I don't know how old you are, but if you were around for the glory days of the 80's this was all you had to show for it:

Major league titles
World Series titles (0) None
NL Pennants (0) None
AL Pennants (1) 1982
NL Central Division titles (0) None
AL East Division titles [1] 1982
Wild card berths (0) None

Wow. If not for 1982 you could still be hanging your hat on, well, nevermind, you couldn't hang you hat on ANYTHING.

What more than chronic delusion could lead yourself to root for the "Brew Crew" or whatever hokey name you can derive from benefiting from having terrible beer brewed in your town. Good lord.

Does your future look bright? Sure. You may end up with yet another glorious second place finish. That is success, my man, that is success.

 
at 8:56 PM Blogger NVreds said...

"Could you please fill me in on which "great pitching staff" in ML history had only 70 wins? Has there been a team with a "great pitching staff" that went 70-92?"

70 wins from a pitching staff is insane good, you can win a game without your pitcher getting a win. If you told me i would get 70 wins from my pitchers durinjg the season, id say "see you in the playoffs"

Every team is going to have poor series or bad stretches, thats why we play 162 instead of 15 games. we're around .500, good, get too far below that and I'll start worrying.

I said it after the 1st game, dunn did not look good at the plate, his mechanics looked out of whack, I'm not the least bit surprised he's struggled, i would have said it after at the beginning that i saw this coming. the guy needs to learn how to prepare to hit better, I'm sure batting practice is fun when you can jack balls as far as he can, but it doesnt prepare you to hit. He's always been a head case, personally i dont see that ever changing.

EE, well, if you didnt see this coming you havent been paying attention. Dont really know what you gotta do with this guy, and you can't trade him he's killed his value with this bad start. I was hoping baker would be good for him, but I never really bought into picking guys to suddenly turn a corner. I was rooting for it, but if you asked me i would have said I didnt think it would happen.

Bakers job starts now, this is the time the teams in the past have crumbled and let the bad stuff pile on. if we can stop the bleeding soon then the team will be fine. This team has the talent to compete, its all about putting it together. dont assume your going to win (i.e. tigers) because it hurts worse when you dont and you end up compounding your problems, kind of like dunn saying "i feel a hot streak coming on" then going 0-5. I thought all last year the team was better than they played and they showed it near the end. We wont know whats wrong with this team for at least a month. Good pitching is the best way to stop your losing skids, I'm real glad we got harang tuesday. but the bottom line is you gotta score more runs than the other guy, so scoring no runs is probably not going to do you much good.

Props to griffey phillips patterson and keppinger, them and the pitching are carrying the team right now.

 
at 9:10 PM Blogger robby said...

I'm not jumping ship, because I have never been on the ship. This team is seriously flawed. the starting pitching may end up being much better, which if it is, may result in more wins than last year. But the offense that everyone says is great is not great and has not been great for some time. They score in bunches when they are hitting the long ball, but when the homers aren't there, this team has a tough time scoring. An all or nothing approach does not work over 162 games.

This team is not put together well. There is absolutely no speed, the defense is still very poor, and the clutch hitting is abysmal. Those are not new problems. They existed when Castellini fired O'Brien(he of the 5 year plan) and said he didn't think it should take 5 years to win. Castellini said he wanted to win now. Well that was over 2 years ago and if anyone thinks the 72 and 90 record last year showed the organization was headed in the right direction then you were seeing something I didn't see.

I keep reading about the good moves Krivsky has made and how the team would be much worse off without him. I submit the Reds 25 man roster as currently assembled is no closer to be a contending team than the team was the year before Krivsky got here.

Which is why I said before the season, play the young guys and take your lumps. Joey Votto should play 150 games this year. I could go on, but what's the point. This is a painfully boring team. Could be a long year at the box office.

 
at 9:20 PM Blogger Dave said...

Stat dudes, Has Dunn ever been a good clutch hitter?
My gut feel is NO, not ever.
Has he ever been in shape (since high school)? Has he ever been (at least) a mediocre fielder??
Gut says No & No.

 
at 9:28 PM OpenID Bravesx30 said...

Okay so basicly was this supposed to be some showcase for the rest of the league?
"hey check out our sale on freel and castro!"

honestly without dunn and patterson who is supposed to hit the runs in? EE? NO WAY! Griffey? No he only hits homers when we're up 12.

Great idea for an insecure rookie.

 
at 9:30 PM Blogger Mdogggg said...

Okay so basicly was this supposed to be some showcase for the rest of the league?
"hey check out our sale on freel and castro!"

honestly without dunn and patterson who is supposed to hit the runs in? EE? NO WAY! Griffey? No he only hits homers when we're up 12.

Great idea for an insecure rookie.

 
at 9:30 PM Blogger Mdogggg said...

Okay so basicly was this supposed to be some showcase for the rest of the league?
"hey check out our sale on freel and castro!"

honestly without dunn and patterson who is supposed to hit the runs in? EE? NO WAY! Griffey? No he only hits homers when we're up 12.

Great idea for an insecure rookie

 
at 9:39 PM Blogger Chuck Batsfan! said...

TODD COFFEY HAS GOT TO GO!!!!!! THE GUY SUCKS OUT LOUD FOR CRIPES SAKE!! GET RID OF HIM PLEEAAASE! AND DO NOT SEND HIM TO LOUISVILLE!! WE BATS FANS ALREADY HAVE TO SUFFER WITH MAJEWSKI

 
at 9:52 PM Blogger JerBear said...

Man I felt really good about the Reds after the Milwaukee series, and now this!

Well, maybe they got their bad play out of the way and will take at least 2 out of 3 from Chicago.

I think the Reds offense has been somewhat overrated for the last couple years.

There are a lot of inconsistent hitters, and our big boppers Griffey and Dunn don't hit lefties well and strike out a lot.

I may be crazy, but I also wonder if Hopper may be a better answer for the long run this year in the leadoff spot than Patterson.

I guess Patterson has done well though overall, so it really comes back to the obvious...Encarnacion and Dunn. And maybe even Griffey. I'm not sure he's going to be one of the most productive 3 hole hitters anymore.

Hard to tell which way this season is going to go. The starting 8 doesn't inspire me too much because it's pretty similar to last year's starting 8 which went through long offensive slumps.

The offense may not be as good as we assume, but with the improved pitching I would think the offense would eventually drive in enough runs to keep the Reds in the race.

 
at 10:20 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

MPCB,

Youre right, they will hit, just like they always do, and when they do, by then, theyll be 6 or 7 games back, like they always are.

Im not a fan of "hang with em" when you are a less talented team. You have to do it now, do it tomorrow, and the next and the next. Even if this team plays to its potential every day it still may not be enough to win the division. If they play / hit like this weekend, even once and a while, they have no chance.

They will lose their share, just by being the lesser team, they cant afford to lose games because of errors and poor execution.

Dusty has to somehow make them understand that, and if it takes bruising the egos of guys like Dunn and Griffey,(shuffling the lineup) or putting guys like EE in their place(on the bench)Im all for it, but just letting them play through it will enable them to slack off again in the future, and ultimately cost them the season.

Detroit Tigers? "Hang with em"

Cincy Reds? Play better now, or forget about it.

 
at 10:29 PM Blogger BRM7576 said...

Over the course of a baseball season, you will sweep teams you probably shouldn't and you'll be swept by teams...in 162 games, things even out.

I have been hot and cold on this team. My blind optimism has been given a shot of reality this weekend. Nevertheless, this team clearly has a chance to better than any recent edition of the Reds. I love the pitching that the Reds have gotten early - but I just hate our defensive ability. It's very difficult to win with pitching when you have such an inept defense behind you. With the team we have put on the field most nights, we sure give up a lot. Edwin is not a major league third baseman. I wonder if his big league position won't end up being first base? It worked for Tony Perez (not that he'll ever hit like Perez)...Dunn gives up a lot of hits that other LF would turn into outs. Junior doesn't cover the ground in RF - adequate at best. Keppinger is limited in range...on and on. It's hard to win well pitched games when you give the other team more than three outs per inning.

This team will hit. I think we'll pitch OK. But how many runs (and ultimately games) will we give away on defense?

 
at 10:35 PM Blogger Roodog said...

Changes need to be made. The lack of clutch hitting hasn't been here ALL season. It just became extremely evident with the BUCS series. Maybe this is just a group of guys who hit in the clutch when they are officially out of the playoff race. If that is the case, they should lead the league from the All Star break til the end of the season. Hey, isn't that when Encarnacion usually starts hitting? Coincidence? I don't think so. Brantley was right. He's not a clutch hitter. Where's Spuds Sabo when we need him?

 
at 10:57 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

The bottom line is that the Reds are not a high batting average team, but a high OBP team. They rely on the walk and the home run to score runs. Plenty of men on base in this series, but 0 home runs if I recall correctly. The difference between getting swept and winning 2/3 was the lack of power in games 1 and 2.

 
at 10:58 PM Blogger Richie Rich said...

...oh by the way, you don't judge a pitching staff after 13 games on wins. If you give up 10 runs per game, and score 11, then you're getting a win, but not pitching well.

 
at 11:01 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

I know Dusty says guys are working hard and going to the cage, but there is a difference in:

"Id better hit some balls in the cage because Im not hitting well right now"

and:

Im going to hit in the cage and work on my stroke, and when I get in the game Im going to show that son of a b!+ch Dusty that its a big mistake batting me 7th!


Come on Dusty! Kick some a$$!!!

 
at 11:34 PM Blogger Mike said...

Please tell me the Todd Coffey experiment is finally over.

 
at 12:56 AM Blogger REddlegg in Colorado said...

Hopper and his Bunting is getting on my nerves,if he can't hit get him outta of here.Same for EE,how many AB' is he going to get behind in the count,that's not a recipe for success.When your behind in the count you gotta take what they give you,his decision making has been quit shoddy.I have never liked Jacoby as the hitting coach,I think his coaching stinks.Coffey,i think maybe a little time to see Ky's countryside.I'm tired of his act too.

I want to see results, not scrubs staring over Future stars.

 
at 2:00 AM Blogger kingseyeland said...

Kevin in FtMyers, your posts make me happy. I log on ready to say something and you've done it already. Get out of my head!

 
at 5:35 AM Blogger Rob said...

well we can all end this playoff talk because a team that gets swept by the Pirates and leaves a small city stranded on the bases in the course of a series aint playing in October. Bring up Louisville- at least some of those guys will play hard and wont try to play Home Run Derby all the time.

 
at 5:50 AM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

"70 wins from a pitching staff is insane good, you can win a game without your pitcher getting a win. If you told me i would get 70 wins from my pitchers durinjg the season, id say "see you in the playoffs"

NVReds, I think you're confusing "pitching staff" with "starting rotation". That's why I asked about the 70-92 record, implying 70 wins total, not just 70 W's by the starting rotation.

 
at 6:01 AM Blogger Al in Ohio said...

Jon at 7:49 -

You're absolutely right! Since 1982, when I was a senior in high school, the Brewers were regularly MISERABLE until the last couple of years. The difference is that I didn't hear people saying, even after Ben Sheets came up, "Oh, now we have this great young pitcher! I think we're going to win the division now!" Or, "We lost again today. Let's trade everybody and fire the manager!"

It isn't about who's good or bad right now. It's about being able to realistically evaluate your team's prospects. Middle of the road, honest, realistic projections seem to have no place on this board. It's "they'll win the division" or "They suck. Fire everybody."

 
at 6:12 AM Blogger Steve said...

It's April fellas...take a chill pill and relax. Not worried. Too much talent, granted, which needs tweaking, to say down for too long.

Per tweaks: EE experiement is over. Enough. Time for Dunn-er to hit. We've seen this too many times. Bases jacked, less than two out and he K's. Consistently, the biggest letdown of any player I've ever seen. Bitter Coffee, goodbye. Changes will be made!

 
at 7:48 AM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

most of you..three weeks ago had this team winning the division.. Now..after only two and a half weeks..all you are doing is complaining..Take another chill pill

This team will do better this year and pitchers like Harang, Volquez, Cueto will be fun to watch.

Yet, I told you all winter long there still exists problems on this team..problems clearly evident after the Pittsburgh series

I would have never kept Berry or Hatcher on the coaching staff..they are a part of this lingering problem. Sadly, as is Griffey and Dunn

You can quote me all of Griffeys individual statistics all you want..Yet, this is a team sport and this team has lacked fire and been complacent..for many years..Too many players collecting big paychecks and not playing very well

Did any of you watch Boston play last night and see players like Youkliss and Casey hit with players in scoring position?

Our big boys cant even hit the ball out of the infield..or they strike out.

Reaganspad tell us again how Todd Coffey will be having a great year.

Enjoy the new pitchers and players like Keppinger. This team will be better by ten games. Will they win the divison this year?.. I dont think so.

 
at 8:11 AM Blogger keepinitreal said...

how many times have I heard it's early, don't worry? 6 out of the last seven years prior to this year I've heard that excuse. the only exception being a couple of years ago when the Reds won more game in April than any other team in Reds history. even after the good start in 2006 the Reds still ended up with a losing record. how many more managers do we need to hire before we wake up and realize this group of core players just aren't good enough!

 
at 9:08 AM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

Did anyone notice we have our new manager calling Adam Dunn "Nunner" already and making excuses for the guy..

I am beginning to like Dusty but he, as other managers before him have learned the hard way , that its the "Nunners" lack of performance and "Grifs" complacency that will get him fired

 
at 9:18 AM Blogger Clueless Krivsky said...

Maybe I should change my handle to "clueless Baker!"

Juan Castro over Joey Votto, following a 3 hit performance by Votto, is one of the stupidest moves I've seen a Reds manager make in the last 8 years, and that covers some pretty inept managers.

And didn't Votto also have to sit the other night as well after a 2 hit game the previous night??

This Votto/Hatteberg thing has got to end. Votto is by far the better player, it's time to let him prove it!


I'd ship Coffey, Castro, and EE out. One of the guys I'd bring up is Hairston because he had a very good spring and has continued it at AAA.

 
at 9:20 AM Blogger HoosierRedsFan said...

It's funny how EE gets bashed for not hitting but Dunn gets a free pass. He has been just as bad as EE so far. Luckily both have a history of being slow starters. So hopefully as the weather warms up so will they. Go Reds!!!

 
at 9:38 AM Blogger bsu1 said...

Life-long Reds fan and first time poster. If I were GM I'd do the following.
1. We are hitting like .215 against left-hand pitching and Dunn, Griffey, Bruce, Votto/Hatte are all left handed hitters. Trade Griffey for a right-handed outfielder.
2. Leave Bruce in AAA until he his tearing up the league, then bring him up.
3. Some of you are having trouble separating the horrendous year Coffey had last year from this year. Before yesterday his ERA was a very respectable 3.60. He could have gotten out of yesterday but EE couldn't handle the smash, Phillips bobbled the relay throw on a DP, and it appeared the ump missed a called third strike. If any of those materialized, he would have been out of the inning. Give him a couple more times out and see how he does. If he doesn't make it, trade him.
3. Votto full time at 1B.
4. I noticed at EE's last at bat that he was shaking his head in confusion between pitches. I'd send him, his confusion, and his 4 errors to Louisville and bring up Colbert who is batting over .400 and is a right handed batter.
5. What to do with Ross, Belisle, and Gonzo??? Bako has been better than any of us expected; has been superb both at the plate and calling pitches. So do you keep 3 catchers? I'm not sure that I wouldn't trade either Ross or Valentine.
6. When Gonzo is ready trade or release Castro. I'm a Kippiner fan and I'd leave him at short. Kipp is a strong contender for a batting title. So what do we do with Gonzo?
7. What about Belisle. Leave him in AAA. If Coffee falters we bring up either Bill Bray or Belilse.

 
at 9:55 AM Blogger Brendan T said...

Thoughts from this weekend:

- Why start Juan Castro just because we are facing a lefty? His career BA against lefties is .221.

- Only Baker would further compound a 1B platoon issue by moving Keppinger over there. If he really wanted Castro's .221 average in there, bench EE and play him at third.

- How many groundouts to the right side will it take before Griffey and Dunn finally decide to try to hit the ball to the opposite field?

- Has Freel gotten slower?

- Obviously Coffey needs to go ASAP. The way the Reds have hung with him, you would think he has Mariano Rivera-type stuff.

- The fundamentals of this team are even worse than previous years. I'm not even sure how that's possible, but they are.

- If they want to stick with EE and wait for him to break out of his slump, bat him 8th.

* Even after all of these negative thoughts about this team, I still think they are good enough to hang around in this division. No team in this division is without flaws and our biggest flaw from last year looks a lot better (or will when they FINALLY get rid of Coffey). Our starting pitching is much better than it has been in years and if Baker can finally wisen up and play his eight best position players day-in day-out, the offense will come around. That's the wild-card in all of this.... Baker.

 
at 10:09 AM Blogger Scott said...

The Reds offense is really struggling.

Freel needs to replace EE as the starter at 3B, and Bruce should be called up & he should platoon with Patterson.

Coffey should be released or sent to the minors. He is a waste of a roster spot.

The Reds should flip Griffey & Phillips in the batting order.

Starting Lineup should be:

Patterson/Bruce CF
Keppinger SS
Phillips 2b
Griffey RF
Dunn LF
Votto/Hatteberg 1b
Freel/EE 3b
Bako C
Pitcher

 
at 10:14 AM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

I actually agree with Jack on something for once! We are 13 games into the season, people. Everyone here is complaining like we're half-way through the season already. There's plenty of ground to cover, and plenty of changes to be made. Chill out! It's tough losing against the Pirates, let alone getting swept, but there are plenty of games left to play. We're not even past April yet.

One thing that doesn't need to happen, is Dusty doesn't need to use Todd Coffey in a Mike Stanton role. My question is, why do the Reds consistently put someone into an everyday role that absolutely SUCKS?! I was very optimistic about Coffey this year, but he is doing the same exact stuff as last year, and that's serving first pitch fastballs belt high to the best hitters on every team. Send him down, bring Homer up, and put Fogg in the pen. Enough said about Coffey.

EE is not hitting and he's not fielding. Statistically and historically (I know he's only played like 3 seasons) EE has NEVER played good in the month of April. Bare with the kid...he will come around.

Speaking of statistically and historically, April is a month in which A LOT of players don't play very good. Griffey is one of them. EE and Griffey, based on past statistics, get better and better as the year progresses.

I still have faith in this team. We have good pitching (aside from a bad apple or two in the bullpen), and we have good hitting.

Also, I am sorry John for saying this...but if I hear one more person say that they are no longer Reds fans or are jumping ship because of 13 games into the season, then I am going to flip! If you are on the borderline of "being a fan," do everyone else a favor and go watch the Yankees or something. If you like teams that buy themselves into the playoffs, go right on ahead and watch them. To me, I like to see good players develop into solid winning teams. I LOATHE seeing one guy on a team (A-Rod) making more than an entire major league team (the Marlins). And I definitely don't like to watch ESPN cover these teams consistently like they do either. But hey...that's not driving me away from sticking with my team. You're either a fan for life, or not a fan at all. Get with the program!

 
at 10:27 AM Blogger Joe said...

I would hate to be related to you nay-sayers who have given up after 13 games. I'll bet a Holiday dinner with you is enjoyable.

Regarding EE, I am as unhappy with his performance as many of you but I also remember the 180 he did after spending a few weeks in AAA? It seemed to me he played a pretty good 3B when he came back up. Ohh and he found his bat too! If it takes sending him to Louisville for a few weeks to get it together.

Dunn has always been a streak hitter and he has always snapped out of the lulls. Anyone think he won't hit 40, score 100 and drive in 100 again this year? Odds are pretty good that he will.

I am concerned with Coffey and have been since early last year. His role is pitch in tough spots when outs are needed. His inconsistency costs the Reds games more often than not. I cringe everytime he gets the ball. As soon as Dusty's seen enough of the inconsistency, I'll bet we see Bray or Belisle in his spot.

 
at 10:27 AM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

Rob..because fans complain dont make them any less of a fan..I think people are tired of the losing..more importantly.. they are tired of seeing the same players contribute to the losing year end year out

Its like a bad dream that keeps coming back

umm Rob..its been what 7 -8 years since the Reds have been winners..enough of making excuses and waiting for everyone to develop

When you consider Indiana, Kentucky, West Virginia, Ohio..this is no longer a small market.. Castellini can afford the talent and the fans in fact will come

Yet..we are in agreement..the season still is very young..By the way Rob..Griffey has a history of never finishing a season with the Reds

 
at 10:32 AM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

1. We are hitting like .215 against left-hand pitching and Dunn, Griffey, Bruce, Votto/Hatte are all left handed hitters. Trade Griffey for a right-handed outfielder.

It won't be done, Griffey has a no-trade clause (I believe). Griffey, statistically, hits left handers pretty good, if I can recollect from his career. Wouldn't make much since. Why not platoon Keppinger out there every now and then?

2. Leave Bruce in AAA until he his tearing up the league, then bring him up.

Agreed.

3. Some of you are having trouble separating the horrendous year Coffey had last year from this year. Before yesterday his ERA was a very respectable 3.60. He could have gotten out of yesterday but EE couldn't handle the smash, Phillips bobbled the relay throw on a DP, and it appeared the ump missed a called third strike. If any of those materialized, he would have been out of the inning. Give him a couple more times out and see how he does. If he doesn't make it, trade him.

No one is going to want Todd Coffey. And if someone does, we would get a lower minor leaguer at best. Personally, I would rather see someone work with the guy and develop him further than just get rid of him. I'd like to see Todd Coffey do well. However, I see a legitimate problem in Todd Coffey. I just don't think he is a very smart person in general. If you were smart, why would you throw first pitch fastballs to the best hitters on a team when you are brought in the game?

3. Votto full time at 1B.

Agreed. Votto nor Hatteberg are going to hit well when they are constantly swapped into games. How can they remain consistant?

4. I noticed at EE's last at bat that he was shaking his head in confusion between pitches. I'd send him, his confusion, and his 4 errors to Louisville and bring up Colbert who is batting over .400 and is a right handed batter.

That's a Jerry Narron type of attitude! The only way EE is going to get out of his slump, is to just let him play. Sure, sending him down last year worked, but really only for his defense. EE has gotten better, historically and statistically, in every ascending month.

5. What to do with Ross, Belisle, and Gonzo??? Bako has been better than any of us expected; has been superb both at the plate and calling pitches. So do you keep 3 catchers? I'm not sure that I wouldn't trade either Ross or Valentine.

Put Gonzo in at SS. Play Keppinger at a different position every night to keep him in the lineup. SOMEONE is going to need a break almost every day within that lineup, and Kepp can play any position on the field.

Ross was striking out 3 times a game in Single A ball this year. We need his defense, but his bat we could do without.

I say send Coffey down and bring up Belisle. Belisle has pitched very well out of the bullpen before.

6. When Gonzo is ready trade or release Castro. I'm a Kippiner fan and I'd leave him at short. Kipp is a strong contender for a batting title. So what do we do with Gonzo?

I'm not even sure why Castro is every on this team. Jolbert Cabrera is a MUCH better player offesively, and is not too shabby with the glove. Why not bring him up and cut Castro? So what if Castro's glove is better. He's HORRID on the offensive spectrum.

Keppinger is a good hitter, but I do not think he has a shot at the NL batting title. Do you honestly think he could hit better than Todd Helton or Matt Holliday? Those are the two main guys that he is going to be competing against.

7. What about Belisle. Leave him in AAA. If Coffee falters we bring up either Bill Bray or Belilse.

I agree, but I think Coffey is on his last leg.

 
at 10:42 AM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Jack,

The time to sit back and relax and just enjoy Cueto and Volquez has not come. This season is still alive and the Reds would do well to wake up and realize that.

If in august they are 12 or 15 back and the season is lost, Ill sit back and relax and enjoy the silver lining.

For now though, a sense of urjency is what is needed.

Without it, your predictions will certainly come true.

 
at 10:43 AM Blogger Steve said...

Since everyone's throwing their expertise into the mix, I might was well wax poetic too.

Again, it's early so I don't put much hope or disgust into April results. However, IF I were GM, here's what I'd do:

Keppinger to 3B the second Gonzo returns to SS. EE to Louisville. I've seen enough to last a lifetime. Got some moxy? Move him to LF where Adam, I usually disappoint, Dunn continues his lack of clutch ilk. 40 bombs a year or not, he doesn't come through when it counts. Never!

Freel and Hopper? Do we really need both? Plenty of equal or better players waiting in the wings at Triple A. Time to cut the cord on some of these hanger-ons. I like Hatty but it's Votto time now. Move him.

 
at 10:48 AM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

yeah.. put Gonzo at ss even though Keppinger deserves to be there.. and then lets platoon Keppinger at various positions all season long and ruin the guy

real bright

 
at 11:03 AM Blogger Cheviot Sports Authority said...

Verdict's about in on Baker. Good in the clubhouse, terrible game day decision maker (lineups, switches, pinch hitters, etc).

Proposing trades on blogs as about as big a waste as having Todd Coffey in the bullpen, but here goes for the first and last time from ST CSA:

Trade Baker back to the Cubs for Lou Piniella. Might have to throw in Patterson and Hairston.

ST CSA

 
at 11:21 AM Blogger kev said...

This team has above average pitching, but below average hitting (especially against left handers) and fielding. Sunday in Pittsburgh was a prime example of their weaknesses. If Hopper makes the catch of the fly ball that turned into a ground rule double, Nady doesn't bat to hit the homerun off Cueto. If Encarcion picks up the hard smash, or Bako doesn't throw the ball into the runner's back on the bunt, or Phillips doesn't bobble the sure double play turn in the 8th, Coffey escapes with little or even no damage. And an inablity to hit lefthanders will insure the Reds will see many of them throughout the summer. Pitching is a key commodity and it looks like the Reds may have some, but the rest of the team is in great need of some changes.

 
at 11:22 AM Blogger 24/7 said...

kepp deserves to play, but at which position is not and should not be in stone. gonzo is a defensive whiz, and his big league track record says so. kepp is a natural hitter, and his minor league/short big league track record says so. the reds were 6-4 after 10 gms last yr. take the good (rotation, bullpen) with the bad (bats w/ risp, vs lhp). ask yourselves, which one was the bigger issue in 07, the good or the bad?

 
at 11:52 AM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

cheviot I normally agree with you..but in this case i dont..

its the same two or three lumbering dinosaurs that that greatly contribute to the complacency and inconsistency of this club.

actually Baker seems quite focused

 
at 12:29 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

I agree with Jack, Kepp is one of the only guys on this team to have earned his spot. (Phillips is the other). NOT "a" spot, HIS spot. Why screw him, just because EE sucks? I like Gonzo fine, but Kepp is younger, faster, cheaper, and a better hitter. We have alot of older, slow, expensive guys on this team, (Dunn, Griffey, Freel, Gonzo), this is a perfect oppourtunity to change that trend. Put Gonzo on waivers, someone will pick him up, or package him with Freel or Hatteberg, or both, time to move on. Neither Dunn or Griffey are going anywhere (this year) so its got to be the other guys.

Or how about Freel, Gonzo, Castro, and Hatteberg (instant infield) for a real catcher. (tounge in cheek)

Then bring up some guys with fire in there belly.

EE isnt going anywhere either (not outside the orginization anyway) Swap him with Cabrera and tell him to earn his spot back.

Krivsky will have to go all in sooner or later, if they stink again, hes fired, so he might as well show some stones and start releasing or putting guys through waivers that arent getting it done.

That may seem a little rash but somebody has to show these guys that the cushy job with a good paycheck and little accountability aint in Cincy any more.

Start showing some guys the door, and watch the rest change their attitudes in a hurry.

 
at 12:34 PM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

24/7 Tony Romo was a backup quarterback and his record and every expert says so. too funny

dude what is ..is ..Keppinger is simply a better ballplayer

keppinger makes all the plays necessary and has plenty of range

 
at 12:38 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

One more thing, Kepp is more than adequate at SS so far, and dont you think 40 or 60 games in hes even better? I think everyone agrees that Gonzo's superiority at SS is slight. I beleive if Kepp gets 150 games at short this year, he can be just as good.

Leave him alone, Let him play, almost no chance its a mistake.

And if you dont think playing him in a different spot everyday can screw up his hitting, think again.

 
at 12:42 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Last thing on this,

On our beloved Big Red Machine, how many guys platooned?

Same guys everyday (other than days off)in the same spots until they are on autopilot.

 
at 1:56 PM Blogger Cheviot Sports Authority said...

You like yesterday's lineup Jack?
Baker is 100% better than the 'baseball guy' or Bob Baffoon. But I still can't agree with playing all of the scrubs at the same time or with sitting Votto against a mediocre LH pitcher.
Yes, the dinosaurs in the outfield are a major problem with this team.
ST CSA

 
at 1:57 PM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

yeah.. put Gonzo at ss even though Keppinger deserves to be there.. and then lets platoon Keppinger at various positions all season long and ruin the guy

real bright


Keppinger is not a SS by trade, Jack. Keppinger came up playing 2nd and 3rd. If you know baseball, you know that SS is not the same as 3rd or 2nd, and just because you played those positions, doesn't mean you can adequately play SS.

He has YET to play a full season in the major leagues, partially because of inconsistencies in his game. Isn't it ironic that you complain about Griffey not playing a full season for the Reds, yet Keppinger hasn't played a full season in the major leagues? Heck, he played for the Royals only 1/3 of a season...THE ROYALS, JACK!! If he was such a kid wonder or the next Ted Williams, why didn't he make a PATHEITC Royals ballclub?!

He is hitting great this year so far, I will agree with that. I agree that he has earned an every day spot in this lineup. But, because of his lack of experience in the major league, and most importantly AT SHORTSTOP, I don't think he has secured that position for himself. This Reds team has only turned 3 (or so) double plays in 13 games, Jack. There's a reason for that. Keppinger is incapable of getting to the base in time for Brandon Phillips' throws, and he also doesn't have a very good arm.

Jack...you and Kevin can "believe" all that you want. But, there isn't statistical or historical evidence to back up claims that Jeff Keppinger is and will be the shortstop that you two claim him to be! When it comes to professional baseball, boys, seeing is believing. When Jeff Keppinger plays a full major league season and produces the way you two claim, I will believe that he can hit .350...I will believe that he can adequately play SS on a daily basis.

Last time I checked, he went 3 for 12 (.250 BA) against a crappy Pirates team. He's also 5 for 24 (.208 BA) in the past 6 games. His batting average may reflect a little better than everyone else currently, but in the last 6 games he's hitting just as bad as anyone on this team.

If Jeff Keppinger is a true hitter, then what the heck does it matter where he plays in the field as long as he is in the lineup everyday? How does a fielding position affect a player's "hitting psyche?"

I have faith in this Reds team, but I am not overly obsessed with a player to the point where I think he's going to be the savior or stop-gap of this ball club and neither should you!

 
at 2:18 PM Blogger Cheviot Sports Authority said...

Keppinger is the SS. He is doing a fine job offensively and defensively. When you find a guy who hits like that and can play SS that is a huge plus in your lineup.

I don't understand the debate anymore. Gonzalez is a .248 lifetime hitter, strikes out too much, played defense like Felipe Lopez last season and can't play anyway. Another big money signing by The Amazing Krivsky.
ST CSA

 
at 2:23 PM Blogger 24/7 said...

rob,

it's the hamilton thing all over again. a guy comes along and does some things, and now he's mickey mantle or derek jeter.

you have a TRUE, CLEAN hall of famer in your lineup, and a guy who'll come a lot closer than anybody else in the current lineup (dunn), and they continuously get no respect in this town. the reds have a good team for once this decade. this is a different situation than they are used to. let this play out a little more, then decide if dunn and griff are really as lazy and warshed up as some say.

 
at 2:56 PM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

24/7 this thing with Dunn and Griffey aint a 2 week issue..been going on for years. My respects to Griffey for being CLEAN..Who cares..many ballplayers are and should be

I think everyone is tired of seeing those two repeatedly strike out or hit a ball to some infielder when men are in scoring position

Rob wake up .what is..is..Keppinger is the starting SS on this team..hes outplayed Gonzo..read all the historical this and that you want

actually when you trend things out Gonzo made twice as many errors as Keppinger last year

Rob maybe John Fay can help you out regarding platooning and/or playing an individual in a new position everyday.. Thats something you dont do on winning teams..it does affect ballplayers

 
at 3:17 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Rob,

"This Reds team has only turned 3 (or so) double plays in 13 games"

Out of how many opportunities? You need that info to validate your point.
Kepp has played short in 12 games by the way.

"When it comes to professional baseball, boys, seeing is believing. When Jeff Keppinger plays a full major league season and produces the way you two claim, I will believe that he can hit .350...I will believe that he can adequately play SS on a daily basis."

How can THAT happen unless you let him PLAY SS? And sorry I cant put you in a time machine and send you to October to see how he does, so I dont know how to argue THAT point.

"Last time I checked, he went 3 for 12 (.250 BA) against a crappy Pirates team. He's also 5 for 24 (.208 BA) in the past 6 games."

Rob, in one paraqgraph you want to see him play a "full major league season" to beleive he can do something but in another you want to use a 6 game stretch to say he cant. Unfair dont you think?

"savior or stop-gap"

Your words Rob, not mine.

 
at 4:02 PM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

AGON - About 4.6 mil

Kepp - About $400,000

Thats alot of money for a guy thats a just little bit better in the field.

There are plenty of guys who can play third, how many can play short? Youve got a guy who is doing it and for not alot of dough.

Play Kepp, give him a couple bucks, (about 1.3 - 1.5 per) and find a way to jettison Agons contract, then sign a catcher or a pitcher.

By the way, Agon 09 5.3 mil
10 6.0 mil

Average games per season 113
Figured throwing out highest (158), and lowest (25)

If he comes back May 1st and plays in 80% of games ( a higher % than his historical #) thats 122 games in 08.

Is that the measure of a full major league season?

 
at 4:08 PM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

Rob wake up .what is..is..Keppinger is the starting SS on this team..hes outplayed Gonzo..read all the historical this and that you want

actually when you trend things out Gonzo made twice as many errors as Keppinger last year

Rob maybe John Fay can help you out regarding platooning and/or playing an individual in a new position everyday.. Thats something you dont do on winning teams..it does affect ballplayers


I am sorry John for saying this, but...

Do you see what I am talking about?? This is the same crap everyone is having to accept with Jack. You throw out statistical and historical proof about something to this guy, and he STILL comes back with a garbage opinion. I understand everyone is entitled to their opinion, but this kind of crap makes posting here un-enjoyable.

Rob wake up .what is..is..Keppinger is the starting SS on this team..hes outplayed Gonzo..read all the historical this and that you want

This little excerpt says everything about Jack when it comes to an argument about baseball. His way or the highway, even if he's been proven wrong time and time again. Would it be so hard for the guy to just admit that he doesn't do his statistical research and doesn't care about factual information? If he can't admit he's wrong, then why is he even posting here? I'm just personally sick of seeing this garbage every time I look at your blog. I really enjoy reading your blog, but this person is a prime example of what is wrong with Reds fans.

Keppinger is the SS. He is doing a fine job offensively and defensively. When you find a guy who hits like that and can play SS that is a huge plus in your lineup.

Here's another excerpt from CSA. Different person, same problem. The guy completely ignores factual information given and further makes this blog less enjoyable for Reds fans to read.

This comes down to their way or the highway, and quite frankly...it shouldn't be that way. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but for pete's sake, have some sense about it!! Be accepting of other's opinions and just admit that you're wrong about something every once in awhile!

Rob maybe John Fay can help you out regarding platooning and/or playing an individual in a new position everyday.. Thats something you dont do on winning teams..it does affect ballplayers

I seem to remember a guy named Pete Rose playing a lot of positions throughout a season...hmmm...

I never said to play Keppinger in a new position every day. But, the guy can play any position on that baseball field. Why not stick him at different positions WHEN NEEEDED?

How can THAT happen unless you let him PLAY SS? And sorry I cant put you in a time machine and send you to October to see how he does, so I dont know how to argue THAT point.

Does he have to play SS to play consistently? That's the question that needs to be answered. We both don't know that because he hasn't played a full major league season, has he? The argument could go both ways on this, but the kid has been with many ball clubs, and HAS YET to play a full major league season.

I think you're taking this totally the wrong way...I think Keppinger is a good ball player. But some of the comments being made about the guy are premature and absurd.

Rob, in one paraqgraph you want to see him play a "full major league season" to beleive he can do something but in another you want to use a 6 game stretch to say he cant. Unfair dont you think?

I am not saying he can't do anything. I was making a point that he is not hitting as well as everyone thinks he is right now.

How is it unfair? The same judgments are being made about EE, Griffey, and Dunn and they have played full major league seasons. That is like the pot calling the kettle black!

Out of how many opportunities? You need that info to validate your point.
Kepp has played short in 12 games by the way.


Good point. John may be able to give that answer to you. But, that is abnormally low. Another point that should be asked, is that if Keppinger had good range (which you would need a full season to get an accurate zone rating) why aren't more double plays being made?

 
at 6:24 PM Blogger JackBlueAsh said...

rob ..its a shame you dont live here and cant enjoy your team.. You are taking this way too seriously dude and you need a chill pill

 
at 7:09 PM Blogger 24/7 said...

jack is back...tries to rile you up with absurd posts and backhanded comments, then once you let him have it, he plays cool and innocent.

back to the reds. they should have plenty of opportunities to get to that cub bullpen, as they did in pittsburgh and milwaukee. i'd like to see more running early in the count, and more freel. other than the customary freel mistakes that come with trying so hard to make a play, he's been good.

 
at 12:34 AM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

rob ..its a shame you dont live here and cant enjoy your team.

Ask before assuming. FYI, I live in Northern Kentucky.

Just stop, Jack. Enough is enough. If you're going to reply here, have some sense about it and quit repeating yourself.

The redundancy of your posts are ridiculous. I'm not speaking for everyone, but I am sure many would agree with that.

 
at 6:26 AM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

Using the stats for the 2006 season, taken from the mlb.com site, there were 4649 double plays turned by the 30 major league clubs in 2429 games. That averages 1.913956 DPs per game or a little less than one per team per game. So the Reds should have 7 to 10

So Rob, you are correct, the number is low, but to assume Keppinger is the reason is unfair.

Some examples of double plays:
143
153
543
53
43
None of which involve SS

I realize these are less common than 643 / 463, but we dont seem to be getting those either.

Other deciding factors, # of ground balls with man on first.

Steals allowed, (gotta keep that guy on first to get a DP opp)

Point is # of DP per game isnt a 100% fool proof way to judge a SS. Important? Yes, but lets be sure.

You could similarly say an outfield has not thrown out any runners and that its te center fielders fault, but the question arises, is the CF the one making the bad throws?

 
at 6:34 AM Blogger KevinFtMyers said...

One more thing on DP #s, the infield has alot of errors this season, which may also contribute to low DP #s

EE 4
Votto 2
BP 1
Freel 1


By the way, Keppinger, 0 errors
(1.000 FP)with more infield starts than anyone but BP

 
at 1:46 PM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

Kevin, I am not blaming Keppinger for the lack in double plays. Just merely suggesting he could be part of the problem because of range and arm strength.

Errors are meaningless if you can't get to balls or throw out runners in time.

 
at 10:31 PM Blogger reaganspad said...

there is no error for the DP not turned as you can't assume the DP.

Phillips turned 113 DP's last year, more than Joe Morgan ever did, and he was teamed with Conception.

Gonzales had more DP's last year per game than Keppinger. Dusty suggested in Spring that Keppinger was slow at turning the DP, which would get you one out but not the second. and would not be scored an error.

Young pitchers need all the outs the can get...

 
at 10:44 PM Blogger Rob Dicken said...

there is no error for the DP not turned as you can't assume the DP.

Phillips turned 113 DP's last year, more than Joe Morgan ever did, and he was teamed with Conception.

Gonzales had more DP's last year per game than Keppinger. Dusty suggested in Spring that Keppinger was slow at turning the DP, which would get you one out but not the second. and would not be scored an error.

Young pitchers need all the outs the can get...


Uh oh! Be prepared for retaliation, regan! The bullies are gonna beat up on you because you proved them wrong again.

I am predicting something like "Coming from Dusty Baker, that's not saying much."

 
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