Reds Insider: Castellini: It was time

Wednesday, April 23, 2008

Castellini: It was time

I just spoke briefly to Reds CEO Bob Castellini. I asked him why they made the move with Wayne Krivsky now.

"We're not winning. We haven't started well. It was time."

He said the move was a difficult one.

"He gave it his all. He's a good guy."

Castellini will have more to say at the 4 p.m. press conference.

I think the thing that did Krivsky in was contracts. Mike Stanton, Rheal Cormier, Juan Castro. I've also heard that he and Walt Jocketty were not getting along great.

Krivsky and I had our differences. But I liked the guy. He'll land on his feet.

76 Comments:

at 12:27 PM

Anonymous said...

I probably wouldn't get along too well with my eventual replacement either. Hope he gets a job somewhere.

at 12:30 PM

Anonymous said...

John - I have to agree the "dead" contracts have to have done WK in- While its tough to argue with some of his moves - I.E. Phillips , Hamilton etc.... I love the way Castellini is willing to make a tough decision in order to promote the best possible team from the front office to the field- Jocketty provides excellent experience, obviously he knows how to field a playoff caliber team.
My question to you John and to all is what do you think this means for guys like Dunn and Griffey for next season, and guys like Bruce and Homer for this season-

Note to Mike Brown - Schedule a lunch meeting with Castellini in order to discuss how to properly run a professional sports team- thanks

at 12:33 PM

ExactlyEsasky said...

You don't fire the GM for the poor start of a major league team. It's gotta be a combination of the contracts and the personal stuff. I don't really buy the contracts beef--Kriv has brought a lot of talent to the REds for nothing, and everyone misses on some contracts (and by big league standards the contracts of Castro and Cormier and Stanton were really not big).

Personally, I think it's a shame. Good talent evaluator, straight shooter, good on the farm system, good on drafts. He blew a few, but he did well on a lot more. Let's hope Jocketty doesn't gut the farm system in a win-now effort.

at 12:34 PM

Zach in MO said...

I know a lot of people on this blog didn't like Krivsky but I think he has done a lot for this franchise. We are in position to compete for years to come b/c of our minor league system. We have Krivsky to thank for that. The Reds will be more successful in the years to come if we continue to follow the model set by the Twins, A's & Cleveland - Build up your farm clubs, develop your own talent, & trade away pieces you can't resign for more talent that needs to be developed. It's a vicious cycle but that's life for successful smart market clubs.
Jocketty worries me. Think about the Mulder trade! But, when you look at the success that the Cardinals have had since the late 90's it's hard to argue.

at 12:34 PM

Dan H said...

From the time Jocketty was hired I knew Krivsky's effectiveness was under the gun with Jocketty waiting on the sidelines. It was confirmed to me at spring traning when both were watching Sergio Valenzuela pitch one day and also Mercker pitch in a AAA game. Neither acknowledged the other and each stood well apart as they did their evaluations. I'm surprised it happened this soon however. Krivsky did a pretty good job getting this organization back on track. Several good moves and some questionable ones, which have been documented on this blog all year. A question for Jocketty, what is his organizational philosophy,do we go with veterans or is it time for the young guys to learn at the ML level (Bruce,Bailey,)? Also what kind of trickle down effect does this have in the minors with regards to coaches,scouts, etc.?

at 12:36 PM

HoosierVirg said...

I have followed this team for over sixty years and this move has me really scratching my head.I am sorry but to me this is a stupid move, you cannot keep changing GM's like we have recently and have any continuity in your organization.

at 12:37 PM

ExactlyEsasky said...

You don't fire the GM for the poor start of a major league team, you fire the manager. Krivsky didn't make the starting eight suck or run themselves out of innings or let bad pitchers off the hook; he's also probably not responsible for our 4 centerfielder situation (Dusty is).

This has gotta be a combination of the contracts and Castellini's simple personal preference for Jocketty. I don't really buy the contracts beef--Kriv has brought a lot of talent to the Reds for nothing, and everyone misses on some contracts (and by big league standards the contracts of Castro and Cormier and Stanton were really not big).

Personally, I think it's a shame. Good talent evaluator, straight shooter, good on the farm system, good on drafts. He blew a few, but he did well on a lot more. Let's hope Jocketty doesn't gut the farm system in a win-now effort. All of the farm system's virtues are due to O'B and Kriv, principally O'B. We'll see.

at 12:38 PM

linuxguy said...

Krivsky's condencending way and waste of almost 13 million on deadwood players finally caught up to him. GREAT MOVE BOB !!! I support the move 100%.

at 12:40 PM

ShinyKefka said...

So, we have a Cubs Manager, Cardinals GM, a Brewers Closer, I wonder what the Pirates don't want anymore that the Reds can have.

In all seriousness, I liked that Wayne would pull the trigger on some deals, some have infact worked out. I'm just hopping that the farm system doesn't get destroyed by Jocketty

at 12:42 PM

The US has a security interest in my soul. said...

Its been almost an hour and the reds havent got better....WAKE UP CINCY FIRE JOCKETY

at 12:43 PM

ST fan said...

I wonder if Baker undercut Krivsky? Blamed WK for the bad start?

at 12:43 PM

ST fan said...

I wonder if Baker undercut Krivsky? Blamed WK for the bad start?

at 12:43 PM

Jon Bachmeyer said...

Well, I've been a WK supporter all along. I thought he brought a lot of synergy to the position, but coming off O'Brien that wasn't hard to do, I guess. I don't know if Jocketty is a good scout guy or not. I don't know. I do know I was impressed with Wayne's ability to spot talent. Money management, perhaps a little different. Personality, he was gruff, but who cares, he always looked out for the Cincinnati Reds best interest. I'll wait to here from Jocketty about his vision before I panic, but I think Wayne was doing a fine job.

at 12:47 PM

Unknown said...

How can we have Krivsky to thank for years to come when all of the stud draft picks were by Dan O? Remember that Krivsky passed on Joba Chamberlain, Ian Kennedy, and Tim Lincecum when he drafted Drew Stubbs.

at 12:47 PM

Anonymous said...

It seemed pretty clear Krivsky's days were numbered when they hired Jocketty, but I'm shocked it came this early in the season. My biggest question, too, is what this means for Dunn, Griffey, and the young pitchers. Overall I'm sad to see him go. He was a nice change after Leatherpants and O'Brien, but hopefully Jocketty will be more forthcoming with the media. I got so tired of Krivsy holding EVERYTHING so close to the vest. Since Dusty has shown, so far, that he'll speak freely, maybe this will start a new era of open communication with the media and fans. Does anyone know Jocketty's history in that regard?

at 12:52 PM

doomgoblin said...

krivsky is a really tough one to evaluate. the list of key players he brought into the organization is pretty long and his draft classes weren't bad.

that said, he was just weird, and he seemed to lack a little bit of nerve. the nerve it would take you to ignore the conventional wisdom and go with an internal replacemnt over a veteran retread. josh fogg for example.

time after time, those old crappy vets got outplayed by younger cheaper versions in the system, and i think that was his downfall. not only did it cost r cast money, but it definitely cost the reds games, and this team can't afford to give any away.

at 12:52 PM

Jack in St. Louis said...

When Jocketty made the Mulder trade, he had no way of knowing that Mulder would have shoulder trouble. Everyone was saying that the Cardinals made a steal at the time. Haren was just a decent prospect, not even that highly rated.

at 12:55 PM

Will T. said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

at 12:56 PM

The US has a security interest in my soul. said...

it really is a shame we lost the skills of a guy like Krivsky, He made so many great moves for a team on such a limited budget...I think this deal had more to do w/ the personal relationship between the 2...and the relationship w/ Jockety and Bobby C, then it did the actual job Krivsky did....add up all of the money we spent to realase the "bad" contracts...and it still doesnt add up to some of the K's you seen released for 1 person....Shame on you Castellini, if u put your personal relationship ahead of the business operations of this team...if we start to trade prospects, I begin to stop buying tickets.... WAKE UP CINCY FIRE JOCKETTY

at 1:01 PM

Anonymous said...

exactlyesasky - I couldn't agree with you more - if the Reds fired WK for a poor start then this move was done in a totally unprofessional manor- I mean there is only so much the guy can do- But as I mentioned earlier I have faith that Castellini made this move cause he was tired of paying high prices for below average players

I also don't think you have to worry to much about Jocketty gutting the farm system - although I can't claim to know anything about his previous ventures with the minor league system - he has put together playoff team after playoff team - something the Reds haven't had in ages
Do you know anything about Jocketty's previous moves regarding minor leagues - is he quick to ship talent for proven players? Thanks

at 1:03 PM

ewad said...

I'm not saying that Krivski was the greatest general manager in the history of the world, but the organization overall is in better shape than when he came here.
Which means (I think) the parent club will soon begin to see the fruits of his labor.
Its too bad that Jocketty will probably get all the credit.

at 1:06 PM

Bob Loblaw said...

I couldn't agree with Exactly Esasky more.I'm sure Walt is competent but he had a larger payroll to work with in St. Louis and the Cards haven't had a good farm system the last 10 years. He and Bob are pals so I saw this move coming as soon as he was hired as an advisor. Krivsky is a great talent evaluator, and he did make some bad signings, which are only bad in retrospect. Nobody would have argued with extending Weathers last season but it already looks like age has caught up with him and he may be done. Same thing with Stanton. Precipitous one year drop-offs in performance can't really be explained or blamed on the GM.

at 1:06 PM

Cheviot Sports Authority said...

72-90 and a bad start this season. That is the bottom line for The Amazing Krivsky. After 7 consecutive losing seasons, I for one believe it is time to win now. This roster is pathetic and Mr Krivsky is the one responsible for putting it together. A GREAT DAY FOR CINCINNATI BASEBALL!
Perhaps there is still some hope for his season.
St CSA

at 1:11 PM

Cheviot Sports Authority said...

The dinosaurs are next. Thank you Bob.
My guess is Jocketty might even find us a major league catcher before next season.
ST CSA

at 1:12 PM

Unknown said...

WK did make some fine moves. I have to think that the failure to address the Reds' continuing inability to beat left handed pitching caught up to WK. The Reds have been pathetic against lefties for the last 2 seasons, and very little was done to address it. Add that to the questionable contracts and ownership probably ran out of patience.

at 1:14 PM

Anonymous said...

Wayne will be a great scout for someone. Tough move, but Jockety has a good track record. The team may be in better hands.

at 1:25 PM

Rob Dicken said...

These comments are funny!

We've had this whole city calling for Krivsky's head for the last 2 seasons, now he's gone and it's like we've released Bob Howsam. Unbelievable! It makes you wonder if people just complain in this city to complain...

And now people are saying that player signings are Dusty's fault? The GM makes the call on call-ups from the minor leagues. The GM makes the call on player signings. He HAS to agree to them. Dusty doesn't have final say in any of this stuff.

It just amazes me how people are quick to retread their thoughts and accusations from earlier when a change is made.

I agree with some of the Negative Nancys around here...no one in this town likes a change (ie. Dusty and Jocketty). We haven't had a winning season in over 7 years people...old ways weren't working.

WAKE UP CINCY FIRE YOURSELVES!!

at 1:26 PM

Jaybee said...

I find it interesting that for weeks much of what you could read on this blog from the posters was how bad Krivsky was: poor moves, bad moves, nad contracts, bad trades, etc. Now, today, it's a lovefest for Krivsky. ROFL

That said, I also find it a curious move in regards to the timing. It takes me back to when Tony Perez was fired after 44 games as manager. Too small a sample size for a very effective evaluation. Wayne did a lot of good for this organization but he also left them with some difficult contracts to deal with. But, it is what it is and now we'll see how things change with Jockety. And I think there will be some changes.

at 1:28 PM

Anonymous said...

The only reason why you can't label it as a bad move is because of the track record of the replacement, WJ.

Was it a necessary move? I'm not 100% convinced that it was. Last time I checked, WK only put the players in place, but he doesn't throw, run, catch and bat for them. This leads me to believe that WJ and WK simply banged heads. When WJ was hired, WK was simply set up to fail, end of story. You don;t bring in a WJ to not be the main man at some point.

Sure, you can point the finger at him for a few contracts. Well, you can do that for just about any GM in the game right now. However, in Cincinnati, those "misses" make a bigger, negative impact because the margin for error is so small. Which is the opposite of the Yankees, for example, who have the money to "play around."

At this very moment, it doesn't matter who the GM is because the major issues with this time are on the field with the players they have right now. Question is, will WJ deal Dunn or Griffey and move towards the future? Or does he believe that they may be a player or two away from really improving this team? Chances are, he won't stand pat.

at 1:29 PM

redsfanwoody said...

I am more curious to see if the people Wayne brought in will stick around or will be replaced.

I agree to the thought the contracts he gave out was a big part of it. If your Castellini and you look what you are paying guys who are gone or rotting on the pine/bullpen, would you serious not question those contracts? Being a small market team you have to.

And lets hope in two years we aren't dissecting a new general manager. Lets go for some continuity Bob.

at 1:40 PM

Brian said...

It's plain to see what's going on here. Castellini wanted Jocketty in and was looking for an opportunity to do so. In short, he needed a pretext. Rather than run the risk of doing this at the end of a losing season, when it would make the most sense, he jumped at the opportunity to do so now rather than run the risk of the Reds perhaps having a winning season and losing the justification.

The contract argument has merit, but it seems far-fetched to think that a GM would lose his job over a couple (small) bets that didn't go as planned, especially in light of the major successes he had (Phillips, Hamilton, etc.).

I understand Castellini wanting to bring Jocketty in, particularly based on Jocketty's track record, I just cannot respect the manner in which he did it.

at 1:41 PM

Mr. Doom and Gloom said...

the mulder deal is worse than any contract krivsky's ever done, and the rolen deal is not far behind...jocketty left the cards farm system bankrupt, yet he gets a pass cause they somehow got hot at the right time and won a world series with an 84 win team that prominently featured jeff suppan and jeff weaver.

too much turnover in too little time. 6 weeks left to prepare for the draft, and the guys who are doing the work probably figure their jobs are gone as soon as the draft is done... not much incentive to work hard. terrible timing and it's bush for castellini to blame krivsky for the slow start.

at 1:43 PM

Dan said...

Strange move... I thought Krivsky was doing well by-and-large.

He was showing an appreciation for young pitchers, and high-strikeout pitchers lately, which I think is GREAT (and perfect when you have a bad defense and a bandbox stadium like we do).

I admired Krivsky having the cajones not to trade our young studs to get Bedard or Blanton too.

I don't know what Jocketty's track record is like, but I REALLY hope this is not a signal that we're moving on to "win now at all costs" mode. That would be a huge mistake in my opinion. Go young, and be good for a long time... even if the "good" part won't actually get here until 2009 or 2010!

Have patience!! Things are heading in a very good direction here.

at 1:45 PM

W said...

I would like to know what it is most of you would like. I've read many comments about not "gutting the farm system." While I'm sure Mr. Jocketty has no idea of doing that, he WILL have to trade some decent minor leaguers to get something of quality in return. Luckily, Mr. Krivsky has done a much better job than others in stocking the farm system. You have to understand, teams do not develop every player thinking they will help their club. You develop some players with an eye to trading them to get others to help your team in the immediate and long term. Would you rather sail along and finish below .500 every year and not make the playoffs for more than 13 years by never trading a prospect, or would you rather consistently be in the playoffs such as Mr. Jocketty was in St. Louis? I think given today's move, it is imperative the Reds win now for everyone drawing a check from the organization. While you never like to see someone lose their job, I'd a lot rather trust my team to Mr. Jocketty given his track record.

at 1:45 PM

gmirones said...

As we look to the future (2009) here is a name worth keeping an eye on. 22 year right hander Daryl M. Thompson, currently in AA Chattanooga. This year he has 1 walk and 25 K’s in 23.2 innings (era .76).
Acquired by the Cincinnati Reds from the Washington Nationals in the Majewski for Austin trade in July 13, 2006. ... Selected by the Montreal Expos in the eighth round of the 2003 First-Year Player Draft.
With continued improvement he could be in Louisville by June or July and we might see him with the Reds in September depending on how the big club is doing.
Started 2007 at Class A Dayton and Class A Advanced Sarasota, combined to finish 14-5 with a 3.18 ERA in 27 starts. ...
Among all Reds Minor League pitchers, ranked first in victories, second in ERA and fifth in strikeouts (121). ...
Was the organization's Pitcher of the Month for April (4GS, 4-0, 0.39ERA, 23IP, 11H, 1ER, 1BB, 19K) and August (6GS, 5-0, 1.80ERA, 30IP, 26H, 8BB, 26K). ...
Was Midwest League Pitcher of the Week for April 16-22 (2GS, 2-0, 0.00ERA, 12IP, 0H, 0R, 0BB, 8K) and
Florida State League Pitcher of the Week for Aug. 13-19 (2GS, 2-0, 1.64ERA, 11IP, 8H, 2ER, 2BB, 10K). ...
Led Sarasota with nine wins and 97 strike outs

at 1:51 PM

LongTimeRedsFan said...

WK was fired because he can't put a winning team on the field, period. All of the patting him on the back for this move or that is bull. It's not like he was personally responsible for coaching anyone's success....or failure. He might be able to spot talent, but obviously he cannot put the right talent together, on the field, at the same time. Nor does he motivate the players he has. We all know Jocketty is a proven baseball man. Let's just hope he puts Dusty and his on the field decision making on just as short a leash an BC had on WK.

at 1:52 PM

24/7 said...

stubbs is not a bust. he's a highly rated prospect. taking pitchers high is risky, especially lincecum.

i hope the wake up cincy mess can stop.

with bob firing krivsky, does that mean he disagreed with krivsky's veteran stopgap approach? judging by all the contracts he ate, it had to be a big issue in some form.

bailey and thompson should be on this team. fogg should not, coffey should be sent down and belisle should be traded. hatteberg should be traded, freel if possible and hairston should play every day in center until he stops hitting or runs into too many dp's. if jocketty does all that fairly soon, he'll be okay with me.

at 2:07 PM

Mr. Doom and Gloom said...

to clarify...i have no problem with krivsky getting axed...i just don't like the timing and i am extremely leary about the old boys club replacement

at 2:08 PM

Another losing season said...

How does this decision impact Dusty Baker? Wasn't it Krivsky who brought him in? Considering Castellini's patience level, if this ship doesn't get righted, and soon, could he be next?

at 2:21 PM

JF said...

YEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

It's about time.

So many financial errors.

Volquez and Phillips, good.

Nearly every other Krivsky move, bad!

Castellini had to stop the bleeding before Wayne signed Frank Thomas to $100 million for 3 years.

at 2:22 PM

Unknown said...

This is a shocking developement!!! I beg, who influenced the signing of Patterson, Fogg, or Affeldt?!? I really don't believe it was squarely on Krivsky's shoulders! What about the decision to pick up Hatte & Dunn's options, pray tell?? This is very disturbing to me and much to my chagrin, I am very worried about the direction this franchise will take under the leadership of WJ... just how many prized prospects have the Cardinals developed since the late 90's? How many of them are still with the club?

at 2:22 PM

Unknown said...

at 2:22 PM

JF said...

Very well said, ajso5, Mike Brown should ask someone how to run a professional sports team, since Mike Brown makes Krivsky look like a genius!

at 2:26 PM

BATSFAN said...

That was something that needed to be done, he was making the worst moves I have ever seen in my life. But I got one question I asked for the job first why didn't Bob hire me lol. Any way very smart move.

at 2:30 PM

Dave in Pittsburgh said...

I have been a long time Reds fan and baseball fan and this is one of the stupidest moves I've seen the team make. This is more than giving a friend a job (which it most certainly is). This is giving a friend the opportunity to go in the Hall of Fame. Jocketty made his mark in St Louis, but giving him another team on the verge of being good for a while will almost assuredly give him consideration in the Hall, even if he didn't put the nucleus there.

I have lost more faith in the organizaton today than in all the consecutive losing seasons combined. Krivsky had a patient approach. That is what you need when your building the minors up. That is what you need in a small market. Now we have a new problem, a meddlesome owner.

Castellini didn't give Krivsky the resources to fix it fast. Krivsky fixed it the only way you can on a budget. He made great trades. He declined to move on others that will be best for the Reds in the long run. That is what a GM on a mid market team does.

at 2:31 PM

Da Phoenixx said...

All of this drivel about the farm system is nonsense. But last I checked, the goal is to win Championships for the Cincinnati Reds. Louisville Bats could have the best team ever in the history of the minor leagues and if the Reds miss the playoffs again, who cares? I understand that the minors are important, but the majors aren't? If the Reds win the division 8 of the next 10 years, I don't care where the talent came from, trades, free agency, whatever, as long as its on the field for the Reds and not "developing" in Chattanooga. Krivsky was Lousiville and Chattanooga GM of the year probably.....but the Cincinnati Reds sucked. So long Krivsky. Thanks Mr. Castellini for loving the Reds like the rest of us.

at 2:35 PM

Jon Bachmeyer said...

It's impossible to say, "The same people who wanted him gone are now lamenting his departure" without actually giving proof. From what I've read, the people that supported him, are puzzled/upset, and the people that thought he was Satan's son, are jubilant and see possible championships on the horizon.

at 2:39 PM

LongTimeRedsFan said...

Walt, here's the word for Dusty....

Jay Bruce in Center. Now. Corey, Freel, Hairston.....well, pick one for backup, probably Hairston since the other two have already shown what they don't have. When Hairston proves he's only the journeyman we all know he is, then we have others on the farm who can be a fourth.

Keppinger at short. AG won't be back for a long time. And he should probably be part of any trade for a catcher that you make soon. It remains to be seen if Kepp is the permanent guy here, though. I'd say our ability to turn or lack of ability to turn double plays is a big factor here.

BP batting 3rd. Somebody sit this guy down and talk to him. Stop swinging for the fence. Start having fun and spread that smile out to your teammates.

Griff bats fourth. Ask him just how bad he wants to play. There is a tremendous lack of leadership coming from this guy.

Dunn. Sign him now. If you do it now you might be able to make less than a 4-5 year deal. Don't let anyone tell you the lack of signing him isn't affecting him.

Joey Votto. This guy is solid and needs to play everyday. He may be the #3 hitter of the future.

EE. I agree, lots of potential. This season will determine his future as a Red.

Paul Bako. Great pickup by WK. Probably won't last (health wise) the entire season. A catching prospect with power should be your first priority. Ross is only a fill in at this point. He simply can't hit.

Pitching. Aaron Harang will win a Cy Young when he can go to the mound every time out and know he will get at least 3-4 runs for support.

Bronson...has pitched in a manner that puts him in a package for a catcher.

Edinson, Johnny, and Homer are the Reds present and future.

Welcome aboard to Cordero. Affeldt, Lincoln, and Mercker should be able to get the ball to him. Get Bray up here now.

Coffey, Valentin, Fogg, Belisle, Weathers....thanks for hanging out. See ya.

Corey, Belisle....nice try.

Hatteberg...Thank you. You've been great, but the team needs to move on. Might fit in a package for RH pinch hitter with power.

Hopper....we love you, but you're not a major leaguer. Take away your bunt, and what's left?

At the very least, please fix it so Dusty can't keep making the same mistakes. Keep his leash short.

at 2:48 PM

Brick said...

I'm amazed at the shock and surprise of the WK firing. If you didn't see this coming when Jocketty was brought on board, you weren't looking.

Corey, I hope you can find your luggage. Matt I hope you can find the door to the 'pen.

Welcome to Cincy, Homer and Jay!

at 2:53 PM

Dave in Pittsburgh said...

When you fix a team right, the results unfortunately are that the highest levels shows the results last. That is where the impatience comes in.

This is just an excuse to give a friend the job. Krivsky can't make Dunn and Junior hit lefties. He can't make pitchers bunt successfully. Baker is in charge of that.

If this is how early Krivsky gets the ax, how much influence do you think Castellini had on the manager choice? Dusty wasn't right for this team ( but it may work out). Dusty gives veterans the benefit of the doubt. It is his history. Giving that to Dunn and Griffey for illogical. They play better for managers who don't coddle them historically.

I really want to know how Jocketty would have fixed this team's main issue, how to beat lefties?

Would he have traded Griffey when he is just short of 600? Would he have traded Dunn and then let Griffey walk after this year. I don't think so. He would have done what everyone else expected. Let Griffey walk after this year and resign Dunn.

at 3:00 PM

Reds Fan of Toledo said...

How is this a bad move? The guy bumped heads with many people in the organization. Many baseball experts is rated one of the worse GM's in baseball. The rebuilding on the minors was really done before he got here. This great "talent evaluator" has had two very low rated draft classes. The Reds are Still paying for Stanton and Cormier. And the Reds have vastly over paid Freel and Ross. This move had to be done.

at 3:10 PM

oldtimer said...

I guess the tens of millions of dollars that Krivsky blew on bad signings don't mean that much to most people, unless you're Bob Castellini and it's your money.

Veggie Bob hired Krivsky and let him do his job. He said early that he wanted to give him the tools to succeed quickly. Mr Secretive fired himself. He bet on way too many losers at the contract table. Last winter he jousted with some very good scouts and the Reds lost them. He continued to have a fetish for marginal retreads. rewarding them with multi year deals. Coffey and Freel's are the worst, although Patterson and Ross are close. Cormier and Stanton cost Bob C. a bundle too. And Gonzalez has been a total bust. Bad business for the guy paying the bills.

Veggie Bob is trying to save THIS season. How bout thanking the guy? At least he wants to win now and is hustling to fix things. Last year was wretched. The Reds were done in May, for chrissakes. And this year's team threatened to beat that record. Too many failures, and weird information barriers with Krivsky. Sometimes when a team riees from the ashes, it has to go through a range of personel to get there.

I don't fret the loss at all. I think it was imminent and necessary. My only curiosity is will the Reds launch the youth movement in the next month and if so, how will they deal with the contracts they'll try to move but can't?

at 3:10 PM

Jack in St. Louis said...

I find it interesting that everyone talks about how bad our start has been, considering that 18 of our 21 games have been against Arizona, Philadelphia, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Los Angeles. We are 9 and 9 versus those teams...the only bad part in my mind was losing 3 to Pittsburgh. Considering that we haven't been hitting, I'd say that isn't horrible. San Diego, Los Angeles, Cleveland, and Colorado all have similar records, and, I don't think they're ready to toss in the towel just yet. Let's see where we are in another month.

at 3:12 PM

Monclova Steve said...

I don't agree with those who have been calling for Wayne Krivsky's head forever. I also don't agree with those that think he's been great.
He's done some good things with the farm system to build up and develop prospects. He's made a few good acquisitions as well.
BUT, the primary job of a major league GM is to acquire players to give his manager a roster with which he can compete.
This team has too many look-alikes -- Freel/Hopper/Hairston (speed but no power); Bako/Ross (defense w/little proven offense); Votto/Hatteberg (both lefties at the plate).
Combine that with Patterson's signing -- and contract -- with the lack of proper choices for Baker in the late innings, and Mr. Krivsky has put together a team that, at best, can be a 3rd/4th place club.
I won't even get into the past contracts the Reds have eaten.
On balance, probably a good move.

at 3:14 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

Do YOU really believe Krivsky wrote these contracts without Castellini's approval?

Do you really believe this hooey that the Reds' slow start was the final straw?

Do you really believe ANYTHING other than Castellini wanted Jocketty to run his baseball ops and fell into one of the lamest excuses possible for hiring him?

Old . . . boys . . . school. Plain and simple. Pathetic, this organization.

at 3:16 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

Oh, for those of you who think Jocketty is a world-beater GM because of the Cardinals' record . . . don't you think any you fantasy league geniuses could have made some of the Cardinals' moves with a payroll that is about $30 million a year higher than the Reds'?

Brian Cashman has been GM of the Yankees 10 years. They go to the playoffs every year. You think he's a blithering genius or he's been able to purchases those rings?

There's no active GM more overrated than Walt Jocketty.

at 3:17 PM

Jack in St. Louis said...

Mulder and Rolen were worse than any deal Krivsky made? You're kidding, right?

Mulder went 16-8 his first year as a Cardinal, and Rolen hit 28 home runs and drove in 104 runs his first Card season, and came back his second year to hit 34 homers and drive in 124 rbi's.

Both players got hurt. I guess Jocketty should have foreseen that coming.

at 3:18 PM

Tucker said...

Mr Castellini has a reputation in the community as being a very good boss, an extremely loyal man to work for. Mr Castellini also expects his employees to perform for him . And this is a good thing.

I would expect that his patience has grown thin and that he really wants to see a winner. I would also expect that they will jettison some players that we always make excuses for year in year out

I would have to agree with various bloggers, many of you were wanting WK to be fired and now that he is gone you are lamenting his departure. I dont understand this

I know I am excited, there is much baseball to be played this season and perhaps Jocketty can take us to the playoffs

I agree with the other poster that stated "old ways were not working"

thank you

T

at 3:25 PM

Jack in St. Louis said...

---just how many prized prospects have the Cardinals developed since the late 90's? How many of them are still with the club?

Well, Albert Pujols is one who immediately comes to mind. Eli Marrero is one of the finest catchers in all of baseball. They also have a top flight OF prospect, Colby Rasmus, who is ranked right behind Bruce. Dan Haren is also a product of their farm system. While not deep, they're system has produced a few stars.

at 3:31 PM

Cheviot Sports Authority said...

Once again Reds management has listened to what St CSA has been preaching. Thank you Bob Castellini.
St CSA

at 3:33 PM

The US has a security interest in my soul. said...

haha i hope you can realize my WAKE UP CINCY FIRE JOCKETTY was in Jest lol...However, I was a bit upset by the Krivsky let go...I liked the guy, and I liked not knowing about potential deals, bc that meant noone else did either ie we got F.C. for the price other teams couldve got him for

at 3:35 PM

Unknown said...

I personally like this move because I think Jocketty has better eye for talent and has proven that he knows how to find the right chemistry. The lesson learned here is: Win or you will have your walking papers.

at 3:37 PM

Jeff said...

I don't think folks are necessarily surprised that it happened, just that it happened this early in the season. I agree with John that having to eat close to $8M in salaries in a little less than a year didn't help his cause. Especially when you see Corey Patterson (and his $3M salary) being the next candidate for the chopping block.

at 3:43 PM

Unknown said...

Needless to say, it's about bloody time we let the clueless one walk!

Though I do give him credit for having the guts to deal Hamilton for Volquez.

at 3:44 PM

NVreds said...

the pirates are about thinking about releasing morris who they owe 10 MILLION

the giants are paying zito FOR 7 YEARS and tons of millions

the dodgers are paying schmidt 10 million to be on DL, pierre 10million+ to be a 4th OF, jones 12mil+ to hit .180, and garciaparra 10mil+ to be an average 3B

The orioles released someone owed 12mil this offseason.

someone else i saw DFA'd a 9mil contract this offseason

this is off the top of my head, bad signings like this happen, and we complain about cormier and stanton. its pathetic really.

I'm not a supporter of this move, but i'm not really against it either. We expect guys to come into a franchise that was in shambles (at ML level and minors) and suddenly create a winning team. its backwards thinking really, not very intelligent to just look at this organization and not others and judge kriv on what he's done. I applaud the man for not trading away the farm to get bedard(DL) given the obvious hot seat he was in, that was pretty gutsy, and its going to work out for us in the long run. also you can credit a few 1st rounders leatherpants drafted, what about the rest, i havent seen anything from wagner, have you?

Your all crazy to blame this man for the state of the team, and its too bad we're losing one more talent evaluator from the front office, hopefully our scouting department isnt too connected with him and bolts at the first opportunity. the team really isnt off to that bad a start when you look at the yankees/tigers #1 & #2 payroll and they cant even be above .500, i doubt that continues.

Ah well, at least we have a proven mind as a replacemtent, for that i feel lucky. personally i would trade coffey, hatteberg, dunn, valentin and patterson right away, though i'm fully aware its not that easy.

Its too bad we couldnt just hire kriv as the minor league director or something, because for every bad move he's made up for it with the phillips, keppinger, burton, hamilton, volquez deals, and not trading votto, bruce, bailey will probably turn out to be very smart given the fact that he was desperate to keep his job at the time.

go jocketty, I EXPECT you to make us a winner given the groundwork your predecessor laid out for you.

at 3:45 PM

sabr_blogger said...

Courtesy of http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

Notable moves during Krivsky's tenure:

* 2-12-06: Scott Hatteberg signed to a one-year, $750K deal.
* 2-13-06: Adam Dunn signed to two-year, $18.5MM extension.
* 3-20-06: Acquired Bronson Arroyo for Wily Mo Pena.
* 3-21-06: Acquired David Ross for Bobby Basham.
* 4-7-06: Acquired Brandon Phillips for Jeff Stevens.
* 5-26-06: Traded Cody Ross to Marlins for a player to be named later.
* June '06: Selected Drew Stubbs eighth overall in draft.
* 7-6-06: Acquired Eddie Guardado for Travis Chick.
* 7-13-06: Acquired Gary Majewski, Bill Bray, Royce Clayton, Brendan Harris, and Daryl Thompson for Austin Kearns, Felipe Lopez, and Ryan Wagner.
* 7-26-06: Signed Hatteberg to a one-year, $1.65MM extension.
* 7-31-06: Acquired Rheal Cormier for Justin Germano.
* 7-31-06: Acquired Kyle Lohse for Zach Ward.
* 8-7-06: Acquired Ryan Franklin for a player to be named later.
* 8-16-06: Acquired Scott Schoeneweis for a player to be named later.
* 8-28-06: Signed Javier Valentin to a one-year, $1.325MM extension.
* 9-25-06: Signed Juan Castro to a two-year, $2MM extension.
* 11-20-06: Signed Alex Gonzalez to a three-year, $14MM contract.
* 11-20-06: Signed Mike Stanton to a two-year, $5.5MM contract.
* 11-20-06: Traded Jason LaRue to the Royals for a player to be named later.
* 12-7-06: Acquired Josh Hamilton for cash.
* 12-7-06: Selected Jared Burton in Rule 5 draft.
* 12-12-06: Signed David Weathers to a two-year, $5MM contract.
* 1-2-07: Traded Brendan Harris to Rays for cash.
* 1-10-07: Acquired Jeff Keppinger for Russ Haltiwanger.
* 2-6-07: Signed Aaron Harang to a four-year, $36.5MM extension.
* 2-8-07: Signed Bronson Arroyo to a two-year, $25MM extension.
* 4-16-07: Signed Ryan Freel to a two-year, $7MM extension.
* 4-27-07: Traded Chris Denorfia to A's for Marcus McBeth and another player.
* 5-9-07: Released Rheal Cormier.
* June '07: Selected Devin Mesoraco 15th overall in draft.
* 10-31-07: Exercised '08 options on Hatteberg, Dunn, and Valentin.
* 11-28-07: Signed Francisco Cordero to a four-year, $46MM contract.
* 12-21-07: Acquired Edinson Volquez and Danny Herrera for Josh Hamilton.
* 1-23-08: Signed Jeremy Affeldt to a one-year, $3MM contract.
* 2-15-08: Signed Brandon Phillips to a four-year, $27MM extension.
* 2-21-08: Signed Josh Fogg to a one-year, $1MM contract.
* 3-3-08: Signed Corey Patterson to a one-year, $3MM contract.
* 4-8-08: Released Mike Stanton.

at 3:53 PM

NVreds said...

Eli Marrero doesnt catch anymore, he's now an OF/utility guy. plus he hasnt shown he can hit. so he's not "one of the finest" at anything. nice try JBA. and u harp on people for using multiple IDs, funny.

at 3:53 PM

Red Faced said...

You had to see this coming but it does seem a little early to me and caught me off guard based upon that fact alone.

I will say this, if it's not to early to replace Castellini then it's not too early to replace Patterson either. He's had enough time to disprove himself as far as I'm concerned. He should be the one with the phantom sore elbow right now not Hopper.

2:39 PM LongTimeRedsFan - I agree with about 98% of what you said. Good stuff.

at 3:57 PM

sabr_blogger said...

I think WK's worst moves have not been mentioned much here:

1. Hiring Dusty Baker. A "veteran's manager" with a horrible record with young players, he's exactly the WRONG man for the job during the current phase of the Reds team development cycle.

2. Signing Coco Cordero to a $45M/4 contract. A fancy high-priced closer is the last piece you put in place after you have assembled a great team. In the meantime - and arguably even once the team is contending - a scrap heap find/failed starter with one good pitch can do 95% of the job at 1/10 of the price. High-priced closers are perhaps the most overvalued commodity in the game among the old school GMs like Krivsky.

3. Being so reluctant to trust the youngsters. These aren't just any youngsters mind you, the Reds have some great prospects. Unfortunately what Krivsky and Baker do not seem to grasp is that every player who's ever appeared in an All Star game - and every MVP - was young once. A little known fact in the Cincy front office. Votto should have been the starting 1B at midseason last year. Instead he's had to kick and scratch and endure having a guy who had a mediocre track record as a hitter in the majors tell him he needs to "change his approach". Punishing EE last April for having a slow start was another example. Any hitter can have a one month slump, but because he was under 35 it meant something entirely different to WK - it meant that maybe his good offensive year in 2006 didn't really happen.

4. The fetish for middling relievers. Krivsky could never collect too many of them.

He did have a good moves though. Certainly not the worst MLB GM. That honor is a fierce competition between BobbleNed Coletti and Brian "Plan, who needs a plan?" Sabean over on the west coast.

at 5:28 PM

Jack in St. Louis said...

---Eli Marrero doesnt catch anymore, he's now an OF/utility guy. plus he hasnt shown he can hit. so he's not "one of the finest" at anything. nice try JBA. and u harp on people for using multiple IDs, funny.

First of all...I am not the other Jack you're referring to...the one in Blue Ash. I live in St. Louis, went to Purcell H.S., and, have been a Reds fan since 1956. If you have any doubt...my area code is 314, my zip code is 63033.

I did make a mistake in referring to Eli Marrero...brain cramp.....I meant Yadier Molina, of course...and he is one of the finest catchers in baseball.

at 5:36 PM

reaganspad said...

If the goal was to hire the Jock, there was no other time to do this move. The Reds are still poised to win 82-90 games this year and doing so would have solidified Wayne's place with this team.

Hey, you are only as good as your last winning streak. O'Doud was on the hotseat this time last year, and that has changed with the Rockies finish.

Good luck Wayne, and thanks

at 6:32 PM

Tucker said...

Mr Redlegs,

The Cardinals did not have such a great payroll when Jocketty took over. He improved the performance of the team, the fans came, they had more revenue, they then increased payroll

Just maybe Mr Castellini wants to win. If he wanted an "old boy" he could have hired a different GM when he first purchased the club. Thank you

T

at 6:32 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

3:57, Castellini wanted a name manager and there was no bigger name available than Baker. Supposedly Baker wasn't Krivsky's first choice;

2.) The Reds' biggest position crisis the past two years has been the bullpen and it cost them a playoff chance in 2006, so they sign a top-notch closer from a division rival who was also willing to cough up $10-plus mil a year, and that's a stupid move?

3.) Let's see, Baker played youngsters in San Fran, he played youngsters in Chicago, he's playing EE (25), Votto (24), Cueto (22) and Voltron (24), and he hates youngsters???? Baffling summation;

4.) On one hand you complain about money being spent but then complain about middling relievers because, well, good relievers cost a LOT more than middling relievers. The money they doled out to Cormier and Stanton is nothing compared to the contracts the Orioles, Cubs, Dodgers, White Sox and Red Sox have paid for their bullpenners.

It's all about perpsective, not urban legend.

at 7:20 PM

Die Hard Redleg said...

This ticks me off. I'm going to be really angry when Walt Jocketty gets all the praise for "turning this team around" when they're in contention in September for the playoffs. Krivsky made a few bad moves, I will agree, but he made some many more excellent ones that I don't see how ANYONE can be angry at him. Arroyo, Hamilton=Volquez (best pitcher on the team so far this year), Phillips, Keppinger, Ross, Bako, Cordero -- all excellent players. The only reason we aren't 13-8 right now is that the offense hasn't been clicking so far. This is by far the best team the Reds have had this decade and when Bruce and Bailey get up here it will be that much better. Krivsky, I'm sorry. You deserve a lot better.

That said, Walt Jocketty's probably the one guy I want stepping in. It's kind of messy and I think Castellini pulled a sleaze-ball move, but Jocketty and Baker should get the job done given all the talent. It reminds me of Tottenham Hotspur sacking Martin Jol last fall for Juande Ramos after undercutting him in the summer. Great replacement, but messy way of going about it.

In any case, playoffs here we come!!

at 8:37 PM

Rob Dicken said...

CSA = JackBlueAsh

Jack has about 4-5 different IDs on here.

This game is pretty bad tonight. Move the kids up in the rotation and start Arroyo less until he gets back on track. Something is wrong with the guy.

at 10:57 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

Good note, Tucker, but since 1982 the Cardinals had been under 2 million in attendance only twice--the strike years of 1994-95--and they have routinely been upwards of 3 million or more for about 15 of those years. So, no, the Cardinals were not hurting for money.

They did go through an ownership change in 1996 when Bill deWitt bought the club from Anheuser Busch. Since that time, the Cardinals' payroll has escalated and in nine of those years the difference in the Cards' payroll to the Reds' has been $37 million, $32M, $27M, $29M, $27M, $32M, $31M, $28M and $32M.

That's not chump change differential.

When Castellini took over the team, it was about 10 days before spring training. The field of GM hires wasn't exactly like going into Wal-Mart. They hired Krivsky based on the recommendation of John Allen, who favored Krivsky when O'Brien was hired. Allen thought Krivsky got hosed by Lindner and Krivsky had a good interview with Castellini.

They had to act fast and the job Krivsky did in such a short time to try and fix a team headed toward 100 losses was fairly remarkable.

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Wednesday, April 23, 2008

Castellini: It was time

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