Reds Insider: Dodgers 5, Reds 4 (it's over)

Thursday, August 9, 2007

Dodgers 5, Reds 4 (it's over)

Rafael Furcal hit a home run off Victor Santos in the 11th to lift the Dodgers to 5-4 lead. Takashi Saito saved it.

The Reds had leads of the 3-2 and 4-3 in this one. But Eddie Guardado and Jared Burton blew saves.

Norris Hopper singled with two outs in the seventh. Jeff Keppinger singled on a hit-and-run, sending Hopper to third. Joe Beimel came into face Ken Griffey Jr. He was called for a balk. Griffey ended up striking out.

But Burton gave up a run in the eighth. It was the second blown save of the day for the Reds.

Guardado gave a run in his season debut in the Dodgers' seventh to make it 3-3.

Guardado's blown save cost Phil Dumatrait his first career win. Dumatrait was very good after a shaky start: 6 IP, 7 hits, 2 runs, 2 BB, 3 Ks.

The Dodgers broke their streak of scoreless innings at 28 by scoring one in the first inning. That was a mini-triumph for Dumatrait. It was bases loaded, no outs. Jeff Kent hit a sac fly, then Matt Kemp hit into a 6-4-3 double play. It was the first lead they had in six games.

The Reds tied it in their half of the first. Brandon Phillips got the run home on a groundout.

But Dumatrait gave up another run in the second -- on another sac fly -- to make it 2-1.

Those fireworks you heard came after Alex Gonzalez's two-run home run, which gave the Reds a 3-2 lead in the second.

Dumatrait put up zeros in the third, fourth, fifth and sixth after the Reds got him the lead.

28 Comments:

at 1:49 PM

Scott Stoffel said...

John-

I know this is going to sound ridiculous, but if the Reds win today, they'll be 9 1/2 games out and playing the best ball in the division since firing Narron. And there are still roughly two months to go.

I know he's been terrible lately but is it worth taking a flier on David Wells? Give him a start or two and see if he can give us anything? If he stinks, what did it cost us?

at 2:03 PM

John Fay said...

I don't think Wells would be interested. I also think the Reds have to keep giving the young starters a chance.

at 2:34 PM

Anonymous said...

Why pick up an Ellison and not a Wells?

at 2:42 PM

John Fay said...

Don't know that I would have picked up Ellison. But, as I said, I don't think Wells would come here. He's West Coast guy, and he'd probably only sign with a contender.

at 3:05 PM

Anonymous said...

New pitchers, same 7th and 8th inning results. As bad as this year has been, with a setup guy/closer this year to push Weathers up to the 7th and 8th inning where he has excelled (note he has been great in the closer role), this team is 10 wins better and in the thick of the division race today. Blame this year on Bob and Wayne for not acquiring a proven commodity to end these games.

DM

at 3:06 PM

Anonymous said...

Coutlangus was acceptable in the setup role as long as he wasn't overused.

at 3:08 PM

Anonymous said...

The West Coast guy is hunting in Michigan, where he and Kirk Gibson own land...he might not come here because he is done with baseball but I doubt Wells would stay away just because it's not San Diego. In 10 days, if the Reds are 7 or 6 games out of 1st, rolling the dice on Wells would be tons smarter than wasting time and money on Ellison.

at 4:18 PM

Anonymous said...

great news guys...

football starts tonight.. let Wayne and Bob live this nightmare by themselves.. John ..sorry you are exposed to this on a daily basis

at 4:22 PM

Anonymous said...

2 blown saves, 1 run loss, nothing but business as usual for the Reds' pitchers, just two new ones today taking their turn at choking with the lead.

Good thing we didn't need Dunn's bat in the starting lineup! Once again, these young players are getting TOO MUCH TIME OFF, especially during win streaks! No way Mack deserves to be back. He's just Narron with longer canines.

at 7:07 PM

RickNMd said...

Instead of blaming Castellini and Krivsky blindly and making claims of assurance and ease about who the Reds should have or should be picking up, tell us who YOU think they should have acquired.

Then, reasonable minds will tell you why that player isn't wearing a Reds uniform.

Each time someone says the Reds should do this or that, like spending money, look at Stanton. To get a situational lefty they had to grossly overpay teams that were contenders. That's what it takes to get players to play for the Reds. Why can't some of you you understand these things?

Why?

It's not fantasy baseball. You don't always get to pick who you acquire. The free agents (and their agents) tell you.

at 9:49 PM

babull said...

RickNMd, lets assume you are right that no one wants to play for/in Cinci. If the free agent market is dead to us, why then were there no appreciable moves at the deadline to acquire the types of pitchers we need? As much as I like Dunn and Griffey, this team cannot win with both of them. With Dunn's relative youth and expected future production I think a way to move Griffey should have been found.

at 9:57 PM

Grizzlyfox said...

Out in Louisville- Cantu had 2 more hits raising to average to .287-it was .255 when he got to Louisville, Votto 3, Bruce, and Hamilton each had 1 hit, Coffey threw 2 1/3 scoreless innings(as he always does in Louisville), and Bray threw a perfect inning, and Louisville rolled 16-1. Cantu is a veteran that has produced in the majors before. He should be brought up now, to see if his hot bat can get him some major league confidence again. Mark Bellhorn has no place on the roster. Cantu does.

at 10:03 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

WHY in this world would David Wells, in his final hour, go to a fifth-place team? And WHY in the world of common sense would the Reds want him?

On one hand you all complain about the lack of team direction and not playing the youngsters; on the other hand you make suggestions of irrationality and nonsense for the the tired, the talentless and the has-been.

Unreal.

at 10:07 PM

Anonymous said...

Better to make no move than to overpay for old fat washed up pitchers. Better to bring up young arms until one actually works--it's a cheaper way to lose.

Why can't some of you understand that? Why?

at 12:28 AM

Anonymous said...

at 6:07 PM RickNMd said...
Instead of blaming Castellini and Krivsky blindly and making claims of assurance and ease about who the Reds should have or should be picking up, tell us who YOU think they should have acquired.

Then, reasonable minds will tell you why that player isn't wearing a Reds uniform.

Each time someone says the Reds should do this or that, like spending money, look at Stanton. To get a situational lefty they had to grossly overpay teams that were contenders. That's what it takes to get players to play for the Reds. Why can't some of you you understand these things?

Why?

It's not fantasy baseball. You don't always get to pick who you acquire. The free agents (and their agents) tell you.

John - This guy's post seems to be attacking other posters. Based on your previous comment about deleting such posts, I'm not sure why this post wasn't deleted. While you're at it, why not refuse to post all comments critizing Castellini, Krivsky and the Reds, and we can all live happily ever after all ... and enjoy great baseball ... which last time I checked, is being played in Cleveland.

at 1:41 AM

Mr. Redlegs said...

Babull, let's say you have a late model BMW you need to sell. You take it to five dealerships and the best offer you receive is 25 percent of book value.

Would you still sell that car?

Therein you and anyone else screaming about the lack of deals at the trade deadline (which really isn't the deadline) have your answer on why players weren't moved. Why give away players if the return is not there?

Remember: In any trade it always takes a minimum of two. Fans forget that way too easily, as if there's some dope GM out there who will gladly hand over whatever you want in trade.

I've said it before and many times again--the market isn't exactly beating down the Reds' door for Dunn and Griffey. Those are big contracts.

at 6:24 AM

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous of 1128 pm.

The POST you refer to as an attack wasn't an attack. He who used a name not an anonymous post refuted what was said earlier. That is a rebuttal. Don't be so sensitive. Many hidden posters here want the Reds to make trades or signings that are impossible. Many want Tori Hunter in CF. If he wanted to come here it would be great, but more money is available elsewhere. It would be nice to trade a bunch Lohse and Hattenburg for "Salty" as was quoted many times, but it wasn't going to happen. People forget the only reason Griffey was willing to come here was it was home. Then many fans try to treat him poorly since he has been hurt. It's pretty unrealistic. I know many fans that wish Dunn were on their teams, yet everyone here complains. There are few 100 run 100 rbi men around. Dunn is one of them. Also many misquote his deal saying the Reds are paying 14 million for Dunn, that is what it will cost for next year, not this year. It seems to be easy to post anon here and then get upset with other views. I would say grow up a bit and this is NOT an insult.

at 8:02 AM

Anonymous said...

"On one hand you all complain about the lack of team direction and not playing the youngsters; on the other hand you make suggestions of irrationality and nonsense for the the tired, the talentless and the has-been."

You misunderstood. Why waste time and money on a CASTOFF OF like Ellison and not a CASTOFF P like Wells when pitching is the problem? THAT wasn't an argument FOR Wells but AGAINST Ellison (and Krivsky)

So you don't play golf? Too bad. Just think, 18 holes of trash talk. Uncensored. For free!

at 8:46 AM

Anonymous said...

Uh, saves only come in the final inning of a game. So, its not possible to blow a save in the 7th or 8th inning. I guess technically you could credit Burton with a blown hold, but the Reds had no save situations in this game (opponents last at-bat, up by 3 runs or less).

at 9:52 AM

Rob Dicken said...

I'm pretty sure the guy just posted an opinion, that's all. He's not attacking posters..you're just blowing things entirely out of proportion.

I don't know about all of you, but I am happy taking 2 out of 3 against the Dodgers!

at 10:31 AM

Phill said...

Mr. Redlegs,

Maybe Boomer misses playing in that Cinci uniform..haha.

In reality though, I'd say there's a VERY VERY good chance he might be done playing baseball in general unless he's still got that fire to keep going.

at 11:40 AM

Anonymous said...

Isn't winning baseball about good
pitching ? Where are the Reds
spending thier money ? They've got
lot's of hitters in the minors, but
few quality pitchers. Maybe the
problem lies at the very top ? I'd hire Brantley as manager today
as he knows pitching. Isn't it all
about pitching ?
Bill
Loveland

at 12:46 PM

Anonymous said...

Bill in Loveland,
Sometimes. In the wrong places. No. Hell no on Brantley. No, not all of it.

at 12:58 PM

RickNMd said...

How many former pitchers have been successful managers?

I think if Brantley was named manager there wouldn't be an ounce of respect afforded him in the clubhouse because he's a 5-and-dime blowhard critic.

I'm trying to think of the two broadcasters who were hired as managers and they got chased back to the booth pretty quickly.

Bob Brenly went from the booth and won the World Series for Arizona but I guess that was pretty much Buck Showalter's team and they hated him. Besides, the D-backs spent amount $6 billion dollars for players that year. Brenly hasn't had a managing job since getting fired there.

at 3:20 PM

babull said...

Mr. Redlegs, I understand it takes two to tango. Also, I was never under the delusion that we could capture a teams top talent for either Griffey or Dunn. I think moving the salary(s)off the books may be the best that could be expected. Both of their contracts and personal situations pose hinderances to any possible deal. It has been discussed numerous times how the language inherent to Dunn's contract was the likely reason why he wasn't moved. If I'm not mistaken this badly written contract can be laid directly at Wayne's feet. Now the talk centers around whether the team will pick up his option for next year. But, of course "that is not on my plate", says Wayne. The most important contract issue for next year should not only be on his plate it should be the entree. If he, in fact, passes on the option then we get 2 sandwich picks that may or may not pan out down the road - 4 or 5 years? By moving one of them at the earlier deadline we get the opportunity to promote youth such as Votto/Bruce/Dickerson to get a good look to see what we can expect for next year.

at 6:17 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

Monsieur Babull, because of Krivsky's secrecy and because contract specifics are rarely disclosed on non-deals, who's to say whether the Reds would have cleared that much salary on dealing Dunn and Griffey?

That's what's so frustrating about fans--they are constantly guessing, assuming and pontificating on these matters of Shouldas, Couldas, Wouldas for deadline deals. As far as anyone knows the Reds were not approached by one team for Griffey (reported nationally) and the offers for Dunn were meager (largely assumed) because of his contract.

How can you crucify the front office without knowing:

A.) What was being offered for therse players, if anything, that helps the team in the immediate future?

B.) How much money was the trading partner willing to assume?

C.) What's the downside vs. upside in 2008 for trading your two most productive players?

Fans are assuming that by trading Dunn his entire salary would be wiped off the board. Not likely. In the vast majority of these deals the trading team has to assume a big chunk of the contract. In these instances, the more money the trading team assumes, the better or larger number of players you receive; the less money you assume, the less in talent.

Another thing about Dunn's contract:

He would have topped $10 million in arbitration the past two seasons and the current contract wipes out two of his free agent years.

In totality, Krivsky locked up Dunn for three years for an average of about $10.2 mil--which is a damn bargain when you consider they could have been battling to sign him in the open market and that price would have been in the $15 mil range.

So, by going deep into the specifics and not postering on the general--Coulda, Shoulda, Woulda--fans might better understand the minute details of Trade Them vs. Keep Them.

at 6:23 PM

Mr. Redlegs said...

RickNMd, the broadcaster who became a manager that I believe you are mentioning is Jerry Coleman of the Padres (1980).

But I think you might be confusing Hawk Harrelson with managing. Nope. He became the White Sox's GM for 1986 and promptly fired La Russa. Thusly The Hawk was fired for being a lousy GM after one season.

at 10:21 PM

babull said...

Mr. RL, I'm just a fan. Of course I don't have the specifics of the ins and outs of all this. No one does. That seems to be the way Wayne wants it. All I know is what I see and hear. What I see is my all-time favorite sports team slogging thru the 7th losing season in a row. I hear the owner speaking jibberish and I don't hear anything from Wayne. Articulate a plan. Sell it to me - I'm buying.

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Thursday, August 9, 2007

Dodgers 5, Reds 4 (it's over)

28 Comments: